TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

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simbo

TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

This TT030 arrived from ebay
had fried stram {red hot}

took out and dressed it up

also change the funnel chips as they are goosed
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Frank B
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Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 28mb???

Post by Frank B »

Mind and post some pictures when it boots with the extra RAM :D Pity the machine was DOA though :(
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Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb

Post by wongck »

Sorry didn't read the entire posting... OP usually post long post :mrgreen:
I can't remember how the mobo of my TT looks like, but I remember seeing somewhere that states those Atari TT ST-RAM boards can be upgraded by changing the dram type on them.
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simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb

Post by simbo »

ye i read the docs http://www.ataritt030.info/upload/dokum ... ramupg.zip
however the onboard ram are 256Kb or 1Mb you need to break out the mad9 line anyway
to get 8Mb to work and dil chips are rare to find cheeper than £10 {total cost to do this mod}
in for a penny in for a pound and change the m/boards onboard ram to use simms
i did find a few places online for this like this guy i use
http://www.arcadecomponents.com/memory.html
but got stone walled
ill get there in the end
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 28mb???

Post by simbo »

Frank B wrote:Mind and post some pictures when it boots with the extra RAM :D Pity the machine was DOA though :(

its a pleasure to restore it for sure!!! nice 1 m8
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware DIAG CART DETAILS

Post by simbo »

youll find the falcon cart board design in another topic is the same layout http://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.ph ... 53#p168353
except this TT030 cart and setup of roms doesnt need to have the added logic ic

here is a couple of photos of its board and the rom images {at the bottom of post}

lo and hi

sorry about the long file names to give detail

so open them is some better system that wont truncate them

you can get a diag cart ready made from 16/32 systems http://sales1632.myzen.co.uk/acatalog/

no telling how it will arrive afterall the verdegre is half my age
and the plastic is even older... hehe :cheers:
its 20 odd years old afterall... i am pretty sure...

i would advise people who have or use or get new carts
to invest in a few strokes of a glass fibre pencil burnish http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/PCB-Glass-Fibre-A ... 53e0e78d90

and clean the contacts before use
or expect issues from leekage and shorts due to copper oxidisation
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simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

it looks like what took the ram out is a faulty funnel ic or two

so ive ordered 2...or will

however if someone has a TT030 pcb thats gubbed i would concider purchase
to reuse the ones it has ,,,

@ $40 each they are a bit steep

i found a company in the uk well they have a uk branch that has over 1300 of the correct ic in stock
perhaps we can all deal with them for any atari custom ic's i sent them an email and ill phone them on monday
i dont think they have a full range but most of the TT ones anyway
http://www.o2xygen.com/parts/C300580001.htm here is the funnel ic link

i have a feeling it will be the usual min order stone wall ill get,.,,
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

http://www.questcomp.com/index.aspx

here is atlast after 1hr hard google and http://www.findchips.com/

is a supplier with 1Mb 4bit ram 20 pin

at a sort of reasonable price with no madness min order sketch and easy pay options
{ie the more you get the cheaper they are}
for a set of 16 is as low as $45 + postage {to uk is $6.50} so for around 50 euros
you can have 8MB of onboard stram

ill get this after i get the funnel chips

i did order from ebay some smd solder thru plcc sockets
this makes life a little easier when it comes to replacing the funnel ic's
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... K:MEWNX:IT

plcc sockets 68pin

ready for funnels... easy resolder...

i decided to replace the 74ALS244 buffer smd with new ones
{i dont trust the whole stram area once the ram is hot :ehum: ...}
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

plcc sockets arrived as did the dil sockets
cost was in total £10 inc post for the 2X 68pin plcc and 16X20 pin dil {cheep}

not the best sockets however they will do fine for this job
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simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

http://eab.abime.net/showthread.php?t=49318

finding in amiga forums a member from poland made up some boards
to allow soj or zif type chips to sit above a 20pin dip

so maybe ill just buy a set for $25 or make some up

so thats the stram solved and funnels solved
i have some spare 8mb types with enough chips on them {any 4 or 8 mb simm will be ok if its 8 or 9 chip and fp <80ns}
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

ok well

a few things happened i got the new 74act244's and fitted them
and i also got the ram and fitted that {dont forget antistatic band and earth}
i found 4bit ram on a site on ebay.com
the guy has quite a few different ic's and its worth getting a set of 256K types
{total 2MB} and confirm this works
before i use a set of the risers above {still to actual get an answer from the guy above in japan}
i have a couple of 4MB simms with the correct 1MB 4bit ram
one pin on each needs folded up and driven from the added 74ACT244 ic ill fit {so i got three}

just waiting for the two new plcc funnel ic's and add a bypass cap
as one of them was blown up

and i can test it....

cost so far is
dram X16 =$26 {~£17}
£3.50 for 3X 74act244
sockets £10 for them all

so so far i spent £30.50
plus two funnel ic's $90{inc postage} = £55-£60 {eeek}

£80-85 to restore it to 2MB for testing
and a further $25 +post for the dil to soj risers {once it works }
and ill take the dram {soj type} i need from these 4MB types i got for £2.50 for two

and i need to change the eproms in it for a set of english tos3.06 as its fitted with german

the use of -60 60ns dram is needed if you intend to clock up the boards chipset {hint}
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Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by frank.lukas »

Hi Simbo,

are you sure it works with 12MB or the end is 10MB because of the address range from the VME bus.
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simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

i think ill add the ram
and if the machine decides not to address it

then this is ok

the max ram for st ram i know is fitted 16mb...- overlap
8mb on one controller and 8mb on the other
infact the addin stram card uses the very same controller that the machine does
they are in cascade
fried funnels is the issue here with me...

it will use 12mb and vme prob it will want 2mb for that

if you dont use the bus it wont hog the ram i assume??

not sure

but i am going to get the addin to bring it up to max

this TT deserves it ... for sure

little bit of love... :angel:
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

i posted this image before just incase anyone feels like making a dil to simm {72 pin}
using a pcb and pin it on the pcb
the simm's can live beside the addin card

i added simms but measured gubbed D i/o

addressing was also not right on the scope

so i replaced the buffers
and decided to go back to a known state and work from there

however someone making a flat pcb has two simms sockets
and some pins to connect to pcb

would make a good project maybe a single sided... pcb can be made
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simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

ok more on this board and two more from frank lucas ill repair

so far i have change a mpu in one and two flipflops in another mpu section of franks boards

with mine that makes three with white screen

using the cart all three give the same issue

error
L2 ram disturbance location is altered by a write to another location

i assume this points to one physical data or address connections short or open

addressing comes from the mcu it looks working on the scope
the buffers are all ok
and ive tested all three boards ram chips and funnels and know they are aok

each machine gives a different address looks like

L1 ram distrubance and gives 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0100 mine
L1 ram distrubance and gives 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 1000 frank 1
L1 ram distrubance and gives 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0010 frank 2


all three boards are rev D-k
has anyone come accross this error and know any tricks to locate the fault easily
as i say i feel all three mcu are gone
as ram funnels are ok
and all three video ic are aok and all are tested in a working machine
i am in the middle to doing board level tests and thru's are being checked also {common issue}
so.. is there is quicker route


looking at the service guide it give no account of the correlation between this error and physical addressing
past a different ram chip cell error chart
ive tried the usual things
still to check 280 or so connections on each board ...

i am doing the same test each time on all three boards
and i made a set of A3 size schematics to act as a main tick list .. set
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

well
i finaly found the time for my TT030 repair

and IT WORKS !!!!! finaly get to play with it and carry out the d-k mods slowly to it
as its a rev D machine
tomorrow ill change the roms for a UK set
as it had german roms when it arrived from ebay

had to replace the mcu and i also found how to read that error address

took me to the exact pin on the funnel ic that had a bad solder
in the sockets i fitted

nice one
well worth 3hr patience to change the mcu out

i used one from a really gubbed STRAM board frank lukas sent over
but as it turned out it was aok once i hot aired both off
it seems these ic's are quite heat tollerant so
super nice 1

so now too frank lukas machine/s both rev d-k also and dal 1978's falcon combel

i have both his machines now white screen and similar ram error too what i had
so i think more funnel work and look for loose pins etc bad thrus etc etc
scratched tracks etc...
board level debug !!!

:cheers: :angel:

:megaphone: yipeee

big thanks go to frank B for buying me it too fixup

well worth it mate!!! :D im so happy i could cry
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bid
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Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by bid »

Whoa!! 8O This is great!?

I think. My TT has only 2MB Ram onboard. The old TT I have has got socketed chips, and as seems to be the case, ST Ram boards are as rare as hens teeth!

I am now making some good progress with the TT that I have been repairing from what was a very poor condition.

I would be happy to do this modification myself, if I can select the correct ST Ram Chips to replace the 2MB of ST Ram and put something tastier in it. I really need ST Ram for some of the applications I use, especially for music applications!!

Would I be right in saying that I can replace the ST Ram. If so, should I post my questions to this thread or start a new thread?

Well done on the modification by the way! :D

Cheers,
Bid
My company website http://www.thebigconsultant.com[/i][/color]
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

i got 16 small boards from cose but he is in japan {i am using 1MB chips i hope}
and i feer he isnt in a good position

i do hope he is ffs cant express this ??


not heard anything

however i stripped off 4 simms to get the chips and ill try to get the boards made
as soon as i unpack my house {as i have been upgraded kitchens etc bathroom and wires ffs for change a colours}

anyway i am almost there and will work more on the tt stram in a week or two
my tt is aok now i hard reset the nvram {rclr pin} works fine no wait state issues
simbo

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by simbo »

http://courses.engr.illinois.edu/ece391 ... 146818.pdf

this ic has no clear pin

so power on the TT with no battery connected

use a tool to setup the nvram

then connect the battery and power off

then cold boot

seems too work ...!


i did this just now
but at first after resetting the nvram using key strokes like the falcon
ctrl rhtshft alt del etc...
only worked with in session
a power down screwed it up

but the add battery after boot works to preserve settings
no more wait state issues now!!!
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Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by Ato »

simbo wrote:i finaly found the time for my TT030 repair

and IT WORKS !!!!!
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
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Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by bid »

simbo wrote:however i stripped off 4 simms to get the chips and ill try to get the boards made
as soon as i unpack my house {as i have been upgraded kitchens etc bathroom and wires ffs for change a colours}

anyway i am almost there and will work more on the tt stram in a week or two
my tt is aok now i hard reset the nvram {rclr pin} works fine no wait state issues
Cheers, Simbo.

I have now cleaned up my TT, with lots of alcohol. Isoprypyl for the boards, and Boddingtons for me. Ive replaced the old hard drive with a working CF Card, using the Acard (you were right!) and this works well. I have also changed the fans on the case, and the PSU, and this is nice and quiet, especially with a small and company PWM fan controller, so its now a whisper. I have added null modem cable for now and set up file transfer to my Windows7 machine, so its ready to accept some softwarez. So all left to do, is the case with some Hydrogen Peroxide and Oxy to get rid of the severe yellowing, and a new keyboard as its pretty broken up.

Yeah, the TT Ram will be cool. And I dont mind a bit of a wait, as I will learn to use the TT with only 2 megs and see the difference of the TT Ram as I will have got used to this speed, so no idea how 32bit effects things! Seems fast now lol.

This ST Ram replacement looks interesting, and to be honest, I might be tempted to try to do an ST Ram upgrade if its possible too, as you know, I really want DMA sound playback for sampling. But now I am networked and ready to go, I have 4x 4MB SIMMS for TT Ram on standby. Whats been the problem with your TT?

Cheers, Bid
My company website http://www.thebigconsultant.com[/i][/color]
Guest

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by Guest »

ok now back to the TT with 12MB onboard ram

i will start again at this to solve it

before i got ssop to dil board as picture above from coze
ill start to strip some ram chips and add them to the board this weekend

i think 12mb onboard will work
i have the ram stripped from the 16MB simms so lets see


nice to bring an old topic back
Guest

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by Guest »

so i asked cose over on amiga forum as posted before about 8 months ago or so {maybe a year now eeek} to post me 16 carriers
he posted 20 a week later {very nice guy!!!} and im glad becouse i lifted pads on 2 and had spares!!!

anyway ive made up 16 carriers to carry the recovered chips from 8MB simms
{remember the TT ram bus is an funneled 64bit bus so 4MB ram over 32 X2 still = 8MB onboard}

{see here http://mcp.selfip.com/download/ST-R_UP1.HTM }
now the TT is able to use 12 MB of a 16 max {top 4 carries roms prefetch or is ignored esp if you have VME RAM} so i can add 8 onboard
and add to my riser better ic's as my riser is SOJ chips 2MB and wont need tedious converters
so just add soj footprint 1MbX4 chips and solder them on from an old 8MB simm
my idea is to remake Cose's converters to add the pins more easily
this is what ill do too my riser
perhaps ill design it and make the boards?? i don't know how people act with soldering irons and rare TT's
anyway this one arrived with red hot ram and still has some issue with wait state im sure replacing the ram will solve
perhaps cose should just make better ones as there is a demand as i said he is a nice guy!!
http://mcp.selfip.com/download/st-r_ata.htm

ill also add a few switches to switch off more ram than 2 or 4 8 or 12
there is no way around adding a riser card to get above 8MB {parallel mcu {memory controller}}
lots of machines {recently i did a A5000 fixed its onboard ram with a simm soj set it used a ram extension to 8MB using the same technique}
riser + on-board dram can equal 16 but only 12 is 'available'

i have 2 on-board and 2 riser not good enough!!! but good riser as it uses SOJ layout of the chips
so easy simm transplant can be made

so the plan is to add 8 on-board so ill add these chips to the risers also
after i test them then 8 on the riser but i can choose to 'switch off' mad9 line to any bank to suite what im doing and the 12MB limit the TT has {rev..d-k}
adding switches can help in diag state
pin to pad and pin to pin cold test are defo needed
build on steps taken is defo the way


the easy way i found for riser soj converter pads was to make up a breadboard with some leds and resistor banks and wires
to allow me to test pads to pins and if i check a pad a two leds or no leds light then i know there is an issue {short open}
with the riser
for sure the risers need remade to take advantage of thru hole pins to the sockets below with the correct pitch
this is what im up too just now

all seems well so far ive mounted 1 ram worth 8 chips
tomorrow add switches and MAD9

happy days


TT revisions and dil sockets

most TT030 REV a-c have dil socket dram so adding risers is one way to upgrade them to 8MB onboard STRAM
some risers have dil sockets most dont
so need either soj replaced or risers to soj

rev d-k will defo need soldering and added socket ram

test mainboard first cold test all then add a bit at a time is defo the way

i will have a 12MB TT this week !
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Guest

Re: TT030 hardware st ram upgrade to 8 or 12mb GUIDE'S

Post by Guest »

cose dil to soj pcb
issues
as you can see by the pic cose's dil to soj the way they come need some carefull carving using a sander etc
mini drill and bits
if you dont trim them then they dont sit snugg in the socket to any degree


ive made up the 16 soj chips now all pin tested and ill do the rest tomorrow

ill post the test screen with no riser for now

:angel:
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