CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by foft »

It does have the simple piggybacked 74 series clock patch. Should I remove that? How about the latest exxos one, should that work with the ct63?

I already replaced the reset cap c7 with 47uF.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by Orion_ »

mikro wrote: Tue Sep 27, 2022 8:11 am This a common problem, usually solvable by different PSU and/or the capacitor fix described here (near the bottom): https://mikrosk.github.io/ct60tos/ct60/ ... ting63.htm.
Thanks for this link, I have a 74F04 fitted near r216/217/222, I thought it was good because I guess it's the sdma patch, but it seems like I need to remove this ...
is the resistor near the SDMA required too ?

I don't hear any audio cracks with the SDMATEST program.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mikro »

Personally, if I had any troubles with stability/operation, I'd go for Exxos' latest clock patch iteration (IIRC it's already 4th generation, much more improved than his first versions).
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by sunaiac »

I also have the factory 74XXX patch clock.
Might be source of some of my crashes at 95mhz.

Have a centuriontech patch clock that I have not found the time to install yet. Especially since this falcon works otherwise.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by sunaiac »

For visual references: viewtopic.php?t=41792
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by jd »

Saw these 68060s from Ireland, are they suitable for CT60/CT63?

https://sordan.ie/product/714/mc68lc060 ... mu-no-fpu/

If so 49 euros is a bargain surely.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mikro »

Not a bad deal indeed but in our Atari world, I can hardly think of any 060 app/game/demo not using the FPU.

Atari gcc uses FPU by default for -m68020-60 / -m68060 and of course all the ported stuff from Amiga is using FPU intensively (because it is freaking fast!)

As far as I know, there is no soft-fpu emulator for all 68881/882 instructions and even if it were, the performance would be terrifying. However for running stuff like FreeMiNT, XaAES etc (integer-only stuff) you could still enjoy super-fast experience with your CT60.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by GCoons »

Hey there CT60/CT63 gurus. I am another one of the new to CT63 world from this latest batch. I'm getting the boot screen but having issues with it recognizing my hard drive as bootable (it boots just fine in 030 mode). One thing I noticed is that most of the time when entering the "settings" I see the following blanks for both CPU and RAM
CT63.jpg
CT63_3.jpg
About 1 in 10 times this information is fully populated
CT63_2.jpg
CT63_4.jpg
Anyone experience something similar?

As you can see I have the sugar-free 060 LC version. The RAM is validated PC133, low density, CL2, Non-ECC etc. 80W pico PSU. No clock patch installed (I'll be getting this done ASAP).
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by foft »

I think sordan are out of stock anyway, though the LCs are still not too hard to get for a reasonable price. They can be used as a fast 030 but most 060 compiled software won't work.

I have some progress with my CT63. I changed my NVRAM battery since it was 2.8V. This was enough for running the clock but not enough to store things reliably. Now it boots without starting in 030 mode, though I still need to hit reset a few times (despite 100uF on C7).
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by GCoons »

In much better state with the CT63. I've been able to boot stably from 45mhz --> 80mhz (haven't tried higher yet). Can run many programs (the cpx and setting trying the various program flags has been a lifesaver there).

The one isssue that still remains with me is that for some reason, I cannot change the TOS desktop resolution without crashing. I've tried with NVDI installed and running and without. Is there some special .acc I'm missing to accomplish this?

I've tried sorting through the plethora of posts here and elsewhere, but haven't found it yet. I'm sure the information exists somewhere, but my google-fu skills are not finding it.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by foft »

mikro wrote: Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:24 pm For CT60/63 I'd recommend https://github.com/mikrosk/ct60tos/releases/tag/1.03c and for CT60e https://github.com/mikrosk/ct60tos/releases/tag/1.03d instead of Didier's 2.x package.

Documentation can be found at http://www.tho-otto.de/hypview/hypview. ... h/ct60.hyp
So is this a different fork to the 1.05 that is pre-installed?

Where is the latest ct60 flash tool? My chip does not seem supported by the versions I found (and the boot menu).

Interesting this batch does not all have the same chip. Mine has this:
https://media.digikey.com/pdf/Data%20Sh ... IEN6izqFx4
0x22d6 device id
ST M29F800FT
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by GCoons »

Looks like I've gotten it figured out. Had some conflicts with the various .acc's and now NVDI is working great and I can switch resolutions! I'm feeling like I'm about 90% there now.

Woot!
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by sigmate »

My chip does not seem supported by the versions I found (and the boot menu).
Neither is mine apparently. I get an « unknown flash device » error message with both flashing tools and the CPX.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mikro »

sigmate wrote: Sat Oct 01, 2022 9:39 pm
My chip does not seem supported by the versions I found (and the boot menu).
Neither is mine apparently. I get an « unknown flash device » error message with both flashing tools and the CPX.
I think we have cracked the mystery on Exxos forum. CT60CONF.CPX and Flash060 do not support the flash chip used in the new CT63. So unless some new information is released from the author, you're basically stuck with what you had flashed, incl. parameters like startup frequency.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by sigmate »

Yes! The CTCM frequency can’t be stored as well. I suspected this to be the cause so thanks for the info. I’ve been talking with Pavel about this, though, and there’s probably some ways to fix this. Thanks!
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mikro »

The ideal solution would be if Pavel released the ID(s) to be added/changed in source code and then someone could rebuild CT60 TOS (you need it otherwise the parameters can't be read from) and CT60CONF.CPX/Flash060 (you need it otherwise parameters can't be written to) and make a new release of the whole CT60 package, same as Willy did with his CT60e.

Btw this applies also to insane's CT60 TOS 1.05. If he releases a new version, he will need the new flash IDs to include there as well (I assume CT63's image has been manually binary patched, I may be wrong here).
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by sunaiac »

I'm sorry you guys are having troubles. I really had it easy.

I had just recapped the falcon and repaired the audio amps.

Did quite a lot of reading before installation to pick right software etc...

First start on empty system (no hdd, no floppy) with ct63 worked (well, to be truthful, second try, when I remembered to put back in stram...). Had to remove shielding for it to fit.

Software pack from Didier worked (cpx, acc, setting speed... just temp readings are wrong). Installed the compact flash using latest hddriver I'm entitled (10.xx). Using nvdi 5.03. Mint from mikro worked first try.

No flashing needed.

If anyone has troubles and is not to far from me we can test in my main falcon (I didn't try the ct63 in any of my other Falcons yet).
If you are not afraid of the post we can try even if you are far.
Last edited by sunaiac on Sun Oct 02, 2022 8:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by sigmate »

Naive question: is there a way to retrieve the IDs via software? Didn’t have a chance to look at the source code yet, but I believe the tools must have some way to read the flash ID in order to compare it to some hard-coded values?
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mikro »

Sure it is. However Pavel mentioned that his CT63 has the ability to boot without SDRAM (normally not possible) so I've been wondering what changes did he make to make it possible - maybe he patched some other things as well. So I'd wait for him to comment.

EDIT: it's also possible that he used more than one flash type. I'd hate to see a new release only to realise it doesn't work for a half of the new owners. :)
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mpattonm »

Guys, I am not hiding any secrets from you. In fact, I can already confirm I have used new flash chips from new delivery so chances are supplier has upped their ID. I have not realized this until now, because I am not programming flash memory in the system, it is preloaded before it is even soldered to the board.
It is not difficult to read batch the ID of new chips, it will just take me some time before I can get to it.
What puzzles me is that apparently, frequency values set via .cpx are stored in the flash memory, rather than in CTCM own NVRAM? Anybody know why is that? It makes no sense to me at all.

By the way, should anyone dive into boot ROM code, most desirable feature to add would be ability to adjust CPU temperature sensor offset and gain.

MIKRO: CT63r2022 is preloaded with stock 1.05 boot ROM from insane. I have made no changes made to it! Yet it boots without SDRAM as you can easily see for yourself.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mikro »

mpattonm wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 12:01 pmWhat puzzles me is that apparently, frequency values set via .cpx are stored in the flash memory, rather than in CTCM own NVRAM? Anybody know why is that? It makes no sense to me at all.
It's not that odd. Frequency at boot is only one of many parameters stored in the flash (new ide vs. old ide, blitter speed, TOS in RAM/ROM etc). So when the CT63 came with yet another parameter, it was the easiest option.
MIKRO: CT63r2022 is preloaded with stock 1.05 boot ROM from insane. I have made no changes made to it! Yet it boots without SDRAM as you can easily see for yourself.
That's really interesting. I'm using the same 1.05 and it doesn't work for me with CT60e (and I don't remember working it with 1.03c + CT60/63). Perhaps I'll try again sometime. I'm wondering whether this isn't a funny side effect of the inability to store to and load from the flash rom. :D (Didier did quite a few dirty hacks where you can make your CT6x unable to boot just because something unexpected is read from the flash and I don't mean only the frequency).

Anyway, if you have list of presently and possibly in the future used flash IDs, I might find some time to make a new release of 1.03, maybe even 1.05 if I ask insane nicely. :)
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mpattonm »

Anyway, if you have list of presently and possibly in the future used flash IDs, I might find some time to make a new release of 1.03, maybe even 1.05 if I ask insane nicely. :)
Just a thought: why does the flash utility have to check for _any_ chip ID at all? I mean it is up to the builders to assemble CT6x with compatible flash chip in terms of capacity, I/O timing, voltage tolerance etc. I would certainly understand the situation utility fails due to some timeout during r/w/v operations, but beats me why it does have to check for chip IDs.
From my perspective 29F800 (1M, 5V pwr) are mostly phased out and it might easily come to the point where I will have to use 29F160 (2M, 5V pvr) instead. Or even 3.3V part! It would be petty to keep rebuilding the flash tool all the time just because of it.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by sigmate »

Maybe the flash tool could use some config file next to it with a list of valid IDs so it could easily be updated when hardware evolves, and it can also trigger a warning if the chip ID is not in the list, possibly allowing to flash anyway with a clear disclaimer?

As for the .cpx I guess that’d have to be a little different. I mean a « force » mode (e.g. holding a modifier key when clicking OK) to bypass the ID check could be done but it’d be annoying to use everyday, unless that setting is in the GUI and saved in config file as well?
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mikro »

mpattonm wrote: Sun Oct 02, 2022 2:09 pmJust a thought: why does the flash utility have to check for _any_ chip ID at all?
Hmm... couldn't there be issues with different sector sizes or something similar? Or I'll ask even more directly, what happens with the flash if the tool forces them without checking? Isn't possible some kind of damage there?

From my layman point of view, that could be the biggest problem. Because you are right, if somebody is stupid enough to build his CT6x with wrong flash size or features, it's certainly not a flash tool's fault.
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Re: CT60/CT63 will be available soon again

Post by mpattonm »

The only "damage" is garbage (or nothing at all) gets written to it, but I suppose contents is verified, once written, or is it not?
I mean it is flash memory, it will not blow. No damage can/will occur.
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