Atari TT030 and system V

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mfro
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by mfro »

tenox wrote:Possibly..
Doubt it (I have a copy). This is a pretty generic book that was kind of the "bible" sold in thousands (if not millions) in Germany. It tries to cover all the different Unix derivatives that were on the market that time (Sys V, BSD, Xenix and all the mess), but not Sys V version 4 (= ASV). Today (and already for ASV) it's of just historic value IMHO (if at all) to get an overview of the big mess that was the Unix market before the main players (most of them still known) emerged. If you really want to code with ASV, the man pages that come with it are of more value.

Quote from another book I just happen to have on my desk:

""The different versions of the UN*X brand operating systems are numbered in a logical sequence: 5, 6, 7, 2, 2.9, 3, 4.0, III, 4.1, V, 4.2, V.2, and 4.3."
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by mdivancic »

Any changes with System V, it's been a while...
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

To be fair I actually didn't have to work on it recently. Everything that I did so far is available on http://atariunix.com/ . When I get some time I plan to make a better/bigger image, utilizing SCSI2SD ability to have multiple LUNs. Now having 256 MB RAM I will be able to build more software, possibly even never GCC :)
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by SoundDoctor »

tenox wrote:To be fair I actually didn't have to work on it recently. Everything that I did so far is available on http://atariunix.com/ . When I get some time I plan to make a better/bigger image, utilizing SCSI2SD ability to have multiple LUNs. Now having 256 MB RAM I will be able to build more software, possibly even never GCC :)
Hey Tenox, how did you resolve the 256mb issue? The last I read on the Magnum thread you could get 128mb but had errors on booting System V.
TT030 10mb/16mb/1Gb, Coco. Falcon 030 Stock 14mb (Lynxman), 1Gb CF. Falcon 030 Stock 14mb (Atari) 170mb IDE. Mega 1 big button (mash up badged Mega 4) 4mb (home cooked RAM upgrade) ICD ADSpeed ST OverScan. Mega 2 big button (4mb), Mega 1 small button (4mb home cooked 72pin SIMM slot), 520 STe (SIPPs), 520 STFM (4mb using a Falcon 4mb board + Blitter).
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

I forgot about this! Never solved 256MB issue. I just install one jumper to mask half off. 128MB is still awesome. Actually anything beyond 64MB is a splurge. My first HPUX workstation in 1992 had 64MB RAM and it was considered a massive amount at that time :)
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by mdivancic »

Iv'e got 16 in my TT, that going to be enough? Which I could find a REBEL board.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

16MB is enough to run Atari Unix. Where it gets tight is if you start to compile a lot of software and with more modern GCC versions which are memory hungry. Unless you are doing this, you will be grand.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by RalfItzehoe »

mfro wrote:
tenox wrote: You cannot mount the /stand (boot) partition (since its bfs formatted - no driver available for Linux).
Yes. No.

I investigated this topic to the point that I understand that there are several, incompatible, versions of BFS (the original one, not BeOS).

Up-to-date Linux (Debian Jessie) contains /usr/src/linux-headers-3.16.0-4-common/include/uapi/linux/bfs_fs.h, which contains the BFS data structures as documented by Martin Hinner (http://martin.hinner.info/fs/bfs/bfs-structure.html). I assume, the bfs-module would mount /stand from the ASV-images if they had the proper format - but they haven't. The mount attempt leads to a message complaining about a wrong magic - effectively, because the byte order of the ASV ist MSB first, while the module expects LSB first.

That observation motivated me to analyse the ASV-header /usr/include/sys/fs/bfs.h from Richard's image. Funny, it contains the comment by its author:

/*
* TEMPORARY!!! Someday soon we should pad this structure
* to make it 4-byte aligned and rebuild all our boot
* filesystems. XXX.aegl
*/

The superblock and the inode structs are different from the later version documented by Martin Hinner, the struct are 2-byte aligned and the inodes have 62 (!) byte. And all data structures are in M68000 byte order.

Based on these facts, I have written a tiny tool to analyse the ASV images and to extract the files from the BFS file systems. The attached source also contains my commented version of the ASV bfs.h header.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

This is awesome! Thanks for doing it! I can upload to atariunix.com.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by theteeth07 »

I have asv on a hard drive..it no longer boots at all. Are there any utilities on floppy or other that I can run to try and "fix" the hard drive...it is recognized as a scsi device when I boot from ICD but i'm not sure what to try. I may have a tape backup but I need to check the disk out somehow?
Thanks
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by mfro »

Here's an ASV boot disk. Write it to a floppy as raw image and boot from it. You might need to interrupt the boot process once the kernel comes up but it should then fallback to a shell prompt. From there, you should be able to mount the ASV partitions and do whatever is necessary to fix them.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by alexb »

theteeth07 wrote:I have asv on a hard drive..it no longer boots at all. Are there any utilities on floppy or other that I can run to try and "fix" the hard drive...it is recognized as a scsi device when I boot from ICD but i'm not sure what to try. I may have a tape backup but I need to check the disk out somehow?
Did you set the ASV boot option using BOOTCONF or a similar tool? Easy to forget about that :)

Otherwise connect the disk to a system where you can make an image copy, so the data isn't lost in case anything happens to the HDD.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by johannes »

Hi Tenox and all other ASV enthusiasts,

Last week I got hold onto a TT which was preloaded with a pretty neat MINT'98 distribution. Nevertheless, on my research advance to collecting the TT I came across the ASV Unix and wanted to see how it works on the TT (Fun fact: I live in Düsseldorf, Germany - where the TT/X Prototypes were presented at the ATARI Fair in 1990 - which I attended, too).

Thanks to your great work I managed to get Richards Image running on my TT using a SCSI2SD and a 32 GB micro SD Card (which is recognized only as 2 GB - but it was the only one flying around). Using my HP "Gecko" with HP-UX 10.20 I was able to dd the image to the card and it instantly worked.

Now I have to get the Riebl VME network adapter up and running. It works with MINT'98 but I assume I have to replace the battery and run the reconfiguration program for reprogramming the Mac Address..

Once I got that working, I will try some ports.

Keep up the good work. Thanks again!

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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

Great to hear that! Awesome that you got another TT up and running. Let us know how your experiences with ASV go. There is quite a lot of work to be done between the images. I think that Mark's image has quite bit of additional software that Richard's image doesn't have. Another unsolved mystery so far is relinking the kernel. I was not able to do it to date.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by RalfItzehoe »

johannes wrote:Hi Tenox and all other ASV enthusiasts,

(Fun fact: I live in Düsseldorf, Germany - where the TT/X Prototypes were presented at the ATARI Fair in 1990 - which I attended, too).

Johannes
Funny - I attended this fair, too. Worked on my PHD in Aachen at that time. We applied for a development system, and obtained it shortly after. I used two SYSV4-systems throughout my thesis work, until 1994. I ported tons of software - including xnews, gnuplot, xgopher, Mosaic, LaTex, emacs, ghostscript, bash - you name it. In fact, the system enabled me to produce a thesis "without glue" (simulations, graphics, text: pure postscript), which was a first timer in our lab.

Unfortunately, the hardware is lost, and I still hope to get a working emulator sometimes.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by mikro »

Seeing all this success I'm pretty happy that I had made those images public nearly exactly 9 years ago! Thanks to Richard for providing his image and Mark_G for sending me his hard disk (which I had shamefully ignored for two years before imaging it). Wouldn't have imagined so much done with it.

Lesson learned: always share your knowledge and projects, others will help one day or another.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

mikro wrote:Seeing all this success I'm pretty happy that I had made those images public nearly exactly 9 years ago! Thanks to Richard for providing his image and Mark_G for sending me his hard disk (which I had shamefully ignored for two years before imaging it). Wouldn't have imagined so much done with it.

Lesson learned: always share your knowledge and projects, others will help one day or another.
Man thanks for doing it! We couldn't have it without you.

Some day I will come back to it and do more work. I plan to combine Mark and Richard's images in to one bigger and better image with more software and do more ports of course. Unfortunately at present I'm little pre-occupied with other projects.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by wbyte »

tenox wrote:Great to hear that! Awesome that you got another TT up and running. Let us know how your experiences with ASV go. There is quite a lot of work to be done between the images. I think that Mark's image has quite bit of additional software that Richard's image doesn't have. Another unsolved mystery so far is relinking the kernel. I was not able to do it to date.
I remember that I was able to relink the kernel while trying to run ASV(Richard's image) with PAM VME network card.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

wbyte wrote:I remember that I was able to relink the kernel while trying to run ASV(Richard's image) with PAM VME network card.
I have Riebl VME card and still cant relink it. I need to spend some more time on it.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by paul92706 »

Hi guy's, i am trying to extract the diskimage (asv-mark.img) onto my scsi2sd and i am using Mac OSX Diskutils. It gives me a "RESTORE FAILURE could Not Validate Source- error 254" when i restore the image, i think somthing is wrong with the source image file (av-mark.img) does anyone have an idea what is wrong? Fyi: I re-downloaded the image file a few times to make sure it wasn't corrupted .
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

The images are good but they are not in a format expected by OSX diskutils. You need to restore it using unix dd utility in the terminal.
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by paul92706 »

tenox wrote:The images are good but they are not in a format expected by OSX diskutils. You need to restore it using unix dd utility in the terminal.
Hi tenox, darn i had a feeling it was the format! Thanks buddy :-)
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by stormy »

Hey guys, I was browsing Calimeros atari software archive and came across this:
http://milan.kovac.cc/atari/software/in ... OS/ST_UNIX

Some parts from the install.txt:

MINT - X Windows - SLIP/PPP - Chimera - Telnet - FTP
Version 1.0 (BETA) 95/04/20
Testing:
-------
This system has been tested on the following system.
1040 STe - 4M RAM, SyQuest 44, ST High
TT030 - 12M RAM, SCSI drive (external), TT High
Falcon - 4M RAM, Internal HD, ST High
Congrats:
--------
You have completed the installation. After you reboot MINT will startup
and then X-Windows will start. On the way to starting up X-Windows

---------------------------
This looks really interesting, a Mint install with Unix X windows. This might mean it could support Mint hardware drivers like Netusbee etc and will be closer to running a real Unix system on all Atari machines. Has anyone seen this before?
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by paul92706 »

Hi guy's i finally managed to write the asv disk image to my SCSI2SD micro drive. Now upon bootup the system is asking me for a "Login" and "Password". I used GUEST as a Login and PASSWD for password, and No go, it is incorrect. Is there somthing i can do to bypass this or get around the Login and Password? Thanks
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Re: Atari TT030 and system V

Post by tenox »

paul92706 wrote:Hi guy's i finally managed to write the asv disk image to my SCSI2SD micro drive. Now upon bootup the system is asking me for a "Login" and "Password". I used GUEST as a Login and PASSWD for password, and No go, it is incorrect. Is there somthing i can do to bypass this or get around the Login and Password? Thanks
I think it's root with empty password
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