USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

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Perdrix24
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USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Perdrix24 »

I'm just finishing CD/DVD-RW support, so that commercially available slim external USB burners work, for reading and writing, with Extendos and CD Writer Suite, both products are now free.

See video of backing up a CF card on DVD-R with 1MB Atari 520STFM and color TV.

https://youtu.be/8jBLPESOHcM

Slow but it works :D
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by 8bitguy1 »

That is cool!
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by catmando »

Perdrix24 wrote:I'm just finishing CD/DVD-RW support, so that commercially available slim external USB burners work, for reading and writing, with Extendos and CD Writer Suite, both products are now free.

See video of backing up a CF card on DVD-R with 1MB Atari 520STFM and color TV.

https://youtu.be/8jBLPESOHcM

Slow but it works :D
Will this work with any cd/dvd rw drive or are there specific models only?
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by MM41 »

Bravo Perdrix24 :cheers:
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by czietz »

A minor note: There are bus-powered USB CD/DVD burners, i.e., without separate power supply. These will draw high current from the USB port, much more than the allowed 500 mA. When using such a drive, I strongly recommend putting it behind an actively powered USB hub so that you don't overload your Atari's USB adapter and/or power supply.

(The Lightning series of USB adapters has a two-step current limiting. You can disable the first step via software, i.e., in the driver, but you're then operating at your own risk. The second step is a self-resetting fuse that is meant to protect against catastrophic overload, e.g., an accidental short circuit. I don't know how well the NetUSBee is protected.)
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by marss »

Superb ;)
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Galvez »

czietz wrote:A minor note: There are bus-powered USB CD/DVD burners, i.e., without separate power supply. These will draw high current from the USB port, much more than the allowed 500 mA. When using such a drive, I strongly recommend putting it behind an actively powered USB hub so that you don't overload your Atari's USB adapter and/or power supply.

(The Lightning series of USB adapters has a two-step current limiting. You can disable the first step via software, i.e., in the driver, but you're then operating at your own risk. The second step is a self-resetting fuse that is meant to protect against catastrophic overload, e.g., an accidental short circuit. I don't know how well the NetUSBee is protected.)
I don't know if there is something similar to that fuse in the NetUSBee, what I know is that the NetUSBee uses the internal overcurrent detection circuit from the isp116x, the problem is that when the driver turns on the overcurrent protection one of the ports in the NetUSBee gets disabled always, so the overcurrent protection is turn off by default in the driver. I'll suggest Claude to make some test to see if that malfunction occurs only in my NetUSBee or it's something that other NetUSBee batches suffer.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by PeterS »

Great work.

I tried Mint USB on my Milan again a few days ago.

It has not worked properly for a long time, only the earliest versions worked without mangling file names and/or for content. David G tried many times to work out why the Milan behaves differently.

In the latest test even the usb loader caused a bus error.

Is a bit frustrating when I see the ST using dvd drives.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by czietz »

Galvez wrote: I don't know if there is something similar to that fuse in the NetUSBee, what I know is that the NetUSBee uses the internal overcurrent detection circuit from the isp116x
That the "first step" I was referring to in the Lightning, too. For the Lightning we selected the external components so that it triggers at 600 - 700 mA. But we made it user-configurable in the driver -- at the user's own risk.
Galvez wrote: the problem is that when the driver turns on the overcurrent protection one of the ports in the NetUSBee gets disabled always, so the overcurrent protection is turn off by default in the driver.
While that is, of course, strange, it at least means that high current devices (such as bus-powered CD/DVD burners) will work. However, I measured my USB DVD drive and it draws in excess of 1,5(!) A over USB while reading. Certainly even more when burning a CD/DVD. I'm not sure the cartridge port (in case of the NetUSBee), the VME connector (in case of the Lightning VME), or the power supplies are designed to handle that extra load. That's why I strongly recommend a powered USB hub.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Galvez »

czietz wrote: While that is, of course, strange, it at least means that high current devices (such as bus-powered CD/DVD burners) will work. However, I measured my USB DVD drive and it draws in excess of 1,5(!) A over USB while reading. Certainly even more when burning a CD/DVD. I'm not sure the cartridge port (in case of the NetUSBee), the VME connector (in case of the Lightning VME), or the power supplies are designed to handle that extra load. That's why I strongly recommend a powered USB hub.
Very good advice. Thanks for pointing this out.
I think the ROM-port fuse (F2 in the Falcon) will blow if 1.5 A go through it.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by wongck »

Perdrix24 wrote:I'm just finishing CD/DVD-RW support, so that commercially available slim external USB burners work, for reading and writing, with Extendos and CD Writer Suite, both products are now free.

See video of backing up a CF card on DVD-R with 1MB Atari 520STFM and color TV.

https://youtu.be/8jBLPESOHcM

Slow but it works :D

Wow Amazing !!! Great work !!!
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by TheNameOfTheGame »

Fantastic work Perdrix24!
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Perdrix24 »

Thanks all for your encouragement.

Warning: I too strongly recommend a powered USB hub. I would not attempt to use my DVD writer without one. My DVD writer needs two USB ports, another good reason to get a powered hub.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Perdrix24 »

catmando wrote:
Perdrix24 wrote:I'm just finishing CD/DVD-RW support, so that commercially available slim external USB burners work, for reading and writing, with Extendos and CD Writer Suite, both products are now free.

See video of backing up a CF card on DVD-R with 1MB Atari 520STFM and color TV.

https://youtu.be/8jBLPESOHcM

Slow but it works :D
Will this work with any cd/dvd rw drive or are there specific models only?
Any, probably, they all use standards MMC commands nowadays.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Galvez »

Galvez wrote: I don't know if there is something similar to that fuse in the NetUSBee, what I know is that the NetUSBee uses the internal overcurrent detection circuit from the isp116x, the problem is that when the driver turns on the overcurrent protection one of the ports in the NetUSBee gets disabled always, so the overcurrent protection is turn off by default in the driver. I'll suggest Claude to make some test to see if that malfunction occurs only in my NetUSBee or it's something that other NetUSBee batches suffer.
A follow up about the overcurrent issues on the NetUSBee. After some test we have seen this happens with the NetUSBees produced by Lyndon and Tuxie but not with the ones made by Lotharek. I've contacted him and he has confirmed me that he indeed made some changes to the original design.
So we should made the overcurrent protection mode configurable too. What I'm not sure about which should be the default configuration.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by czietz »

Yes, looking at the schematic (of the original version) I think I can see the design error. It's nice that Lotharek corrected this. Do you know if the protection works as expected in Lotharek's version - and at which current? Or did he simply completely disable it? (EDIT: If it was the latter, you could leave the NetUSBee driver as it is.)
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Galvez »

czietz wrote:Yes, looking at the schematic (of the original version) I think I can see the design error. It's nice that Lotharek corrected this. Do you know if the protection works as expected in Lotharek's version - and at which current? Or did he simply completely disable it? (EDIT: If it was the latter, you could leave the NetUSBee driver as it is.)
Good question, I've assumed he fixed the problem but not by disabling the protection mechanism. I should ask him to be sure.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Galvez »

Galvez wrote:
czietz wrote:Yes, looking at the schematic (of the original version) I think I can see the design error. It's nice that Lotharek corrected this. Do you know if the protection works as expected in Lotharek's version - and at which current? Or did he simply completely disable it? (EDIT: If it was the latter, you could leave the NetUSBee driver as it is.)
Good question, I've assumed he fixed the problem but not by disabling the protection mechanism. I should ask him to be sure.
No answer from Lotharek so far regarding this. In any case I have added to the driver the option for the user to enable the overcurrent protection mode that for now is disabled by default.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Rustynutt »

Perdrix24 wrote:I'm just finishing CD/DVD-RW support, so that commercially available slim external USB burners work, for reading and writing, with Extendos and CD Writer Suite, both products are now free.

See video of backing up a CF card on DVD-R with 1MB Atari 520STFM and color TV.

https://youtu.be/8jBLPESOHcM

Slow but it works :D
Nix that. Had to enable drive function in HD Driver.
Perfect! Thanks a million times over.

First time plugging in the NetUSBee. Watching your video, I don't see the same scan using the V5 softs package.
Is your driver available via a different site?
My SCSI CD after years of fateful service died. RIP.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Rustynutt »

Managed to use a USB stick fine, however with the DVD RW couldn't get to a point of being able to write to a blank CD/DVD, or read from a UDF format CD that normally is read by ExtenDos on the IDE or SCSI bus.
The driver acc recognized the unit bridge device as does ExtenDos and HD Driver the make/model, and which bus. The system could read an ISO format (Rogers CD Writer disk), but that was it. I tried prepping the disk on Windows both ways, locked and open file system with no difference.
Whatamidoingwrong?
Thanks
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Perdrix24 »

Rustynutt wrote: Wed May 13, 2020 3:58 am
Perdrix24 wrote:I'm just finishing CD/DVD-RW support, so that commercially available slim external USB burners work, for reading and writing, with Extendos and CD Writer Suite, both products are now free.

See video of backing up a CF card on DVD-R with 1MB Atari 520STFM and color TV.

https://youtu.be/8jBLPESOHcM

Slow but it works :D
Nix that. Had to enable drive function in HD Driver.
Perfect! Thanks a million times over.

First time plugging in the NetUSBee. Watching your video, I don't see the same scan using the V5 softs package.
Is your driver available via a different site?
My SCSI CD after years of fateful service died. RIP.
It will be in V6, but if you can't wait, download it here: https://bintray.com/freemint/freemint/s ... estVersion
You will need to use all the drivers from that download together, replacing all the V5 drivers that you have.

The new drivers may fix the problems you experienced in your other post.


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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by czietz »

Galvez wrote: Sat May 02, 2020 5:05 pm No answer from Lotharek so far regarding this. In any case I have added to the driver the option for the user to enable the overcurrent protection mode that for now is disabled by default.
I had the opportunity to measure the available current myself on a NetUSBee (Lotharek version). OCP works -- only when enabled in the driver, of course: at slightly over 1 A, the port is switched off, see plot. (I didn't check if this is per port, i.e., whether one could draw 2 A out of both ports.)

EDIT: Note that this still puts cartridge port fuses at risk. For example, the fuse in the TT is rated for 500 mA, only -- at least according to the schematic.
lotharek-netusbee-current.png
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Galvez »

czietz wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 1:33 pm
Galvez wrote: Sat May 02, 2020 5:05 pm No answer from Lotharek so far regarding this. In any case I have added to the driver the option for the user to enable the overcurrent protection mode that for now is disabled by default.
I had the opportunity to measure the available current myself on a NetUSBee (Lotharek version). OCP works -- only when enabled in the driver, of course: at slightly over 1 A, the port is switched off, see plot. (I didn't check if this is per port, i.e., whether one could draw 2 A out of both ports.)
OK! thanks for the test.
czietz wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 1:33 pm EDIT: Note that this still puts cartridge port fuses at risk. For example, the fuse in the TT is rated for 500 mA, only -- at least according to the schematic.
I'll decrease the value to 500 mA, thanks for the hint.
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Re: USB drivers: CD/DVD-RW support

Post by Galvez »

Galvez wrote: Wed Jul 08, 2020 7:26 am
czietz wrote: Mon Jul 06, 2020 1:33 pm EDIT: Note that this still puts cartridge port fuses at risk. For example, the fuse in the TT is rated for 500 mA, only -- at least according to the schematic.
I'll decrease the value to 500 mA, thanks for the hint.
I assumed that the overcurrent threshold value could be change by software but it is chosen by the hardware design.
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