GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

odd. Does it do that if you open up another app with similar buttons ? Looks like a problem with redrawing..

I will send you my current build later, i did some fixes to that code, but not sure if it will help with your issue or not.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by lp »

I use the same extended AES objects in my IRC app and it does not do this. I even loaded up the rsc, set the bits the same so it looks exactly like the round radio buttons in gembench and it's fine. I've not noticed this behavior in other apps that I use.

The redraw isn't handled by GEM persay, it's actually the apps responsibility. It's handled in SUB ReDraw() in file window.bas of HGT. After looking it over again, I don't think you can just rip out the bad stuff, it looks like the whole app is based on this toolkit, right down to the main loop. It reminds me of facevalue for gfabasic, which also provides a full gem skeleton.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

Yeah, I did try taking a few things out and it just goes nuts.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by GadgetUK164 »

Wow, this is great news! Look forward to testing this!
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

GB5V15_result.png
May not look much different but it has had some huge re-coding over the past few days. Still lots to do, but I am taking a break for 3 days now, so progress will have to wait :)

Most noticeably is the better ROM access speed tests. Rodolphe Pineau wrote a really nice asm routine for testing the speed, so it actually shows a increase in speed using my V1.5 booster :)
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

GEMBENCH 503 BETA
GEMBENCH.5.zip
Please read the readme file on how to use it!

In short, I only have a stock ST and a V1booster machine to hand to do a benchmark. So the default comparison machine is a stock ST. If someone has a Falcon etc then please benchmark your machine and use the "Save SET" in the second FILE menu in the window itself to save the results and send me the file and I will include it. If anyone has a stock ST with blitter then please test your machine and make sure your blitter is on and send me the SET file.

GB503 works different, so please read the readme file!

I have actually hit a brick wall on updating it and fixing things, So I am actually considering abandoning GemBench and coding a new version of it. GB has so many bugs its unreal, the code is terrible and just seems like 20 times more complicated than it needs to be. Any further changes I make and really odd things start to happen. Like the registration form in the RSC file, if I delete it, GB bombs out while loading. If I disable such unused boxes in code itself, some of the text on the main window starts to vanish ?! I mean its a stats(xx) variable of text, so how it gets from a unused totally unrelated dialogue box to blanking out random bits in the stats array I have no idea. Though its clear that it is just to screwy to keep bothering with.

It is possible there are still some bugs, but I think time is better spent on starting on a new benchmarking app. Albeit GemBench 6 :)

If anyone has any HISOFT source code for simple examples then please send them to me. I can do STOS easily, though HISOFT BASIC isn't what I am used to, so having examples how to do basic stuff like menus, texts in windows, graphics in windows etc would really help me out a lot. Once I can get the ultra basics working, I can pretty much copy out the tests from GemBench's code so the proposed GB6 will look and act very similar to previous versions.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by lp »

I bought HiSoft v2 back in the day, some of the features intrigued me, but it felt like their 'C' package with a syntax face lift, seeing how it lacked an interpreter. Then when the GUI didn't work under MiNT I sold it. Sadly to this day no one has cared enough to even patch it. Other than the examples on the original disk, you might be hard pressed to find more or better examples, it don't seem to be very popular. Have you considered porting it to say PureC or something else? I have recently picked that up and can manage to do pretty ok with it, even though I've been a die hard basic user forever. With 'C' you can find examples all over the place.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

I'm a STOS person at heart, so moving to C is to big of a jump. I dabbled in my youth in C, but I actually found assembler easier :roll: Its a time thing really, I would love to learn C, but I just don't have the time. Hardware takes up all my free time as it is.

So reason to code in Hisoft is so I can port over routines from GB. I know basic so stuff like "PRINT" is pretty comon across all basics, how arrays are setup. OK a lot of commands have to be translated such as DRAW in STOS is V_PLINE in VDI. But they both draw stuff, so once I get my head around that stuff then I should be able to program a new version of GemBench pretty quick without having to learn something from scratch :)

This is one of the graphics loops. OK it crashes when its done, but it proves a point :)
TEST2.zip
So I need to work out how to name windows, create close windows, all that kinda stuff. Really its a GUI re-write :) The hardest part is working out how to use stuff from the RSC files. The HGT kit makes easy work of that stuff, but its also the cause of probably all the problems in adapting the code.

Really there is nothing wrong with GemBench's test routines, its the GUI which is just a mash up of chaos. So I need to try and figure out how to do that kinda stuff. Without any examples and without a proper manual. So if any hisoft basic users can chime in and give some clues on how to do some stuff like using dialogues in the RSC file, then it would speed up things a lot. If it turns out to be to complicated then I will just export everything on screen as good old plain text.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by frank.lukas »

I use a MC68010 CPU and Gembench 5 bombs with three bombs at the FPU test ...
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

frank.lukas wrote:I use a MC68010 CPU and Gembench 5 bombs with three bombs at the FPU test ...
Not touched that area of code so assume GB4 does it as well ?
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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frozen my Aranym setup completely :wink:
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by frank.lukas »

Yes, GEMBENCH 4.03 bombs also ...
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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frank.lukas wrote:Yes, GEMBENCH 4.03 bombs also ...
Another bug in the original code then somewhere. Though I doubt many people have a 68010 anyway :wink:
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by GadgetUK164 »

Thanks, just tested this using your 1.5 16Mhz mod, fast ROM and Blitter.
bench5.jpg
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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I'm not really getting anywhere at all with this stuff. Hisoft basic is saying there isn't functions when there is. Its like having

sub hello
print "hello"
end sub

Then calling hello sub, so it should just print hello on screen, but the compiler says "undefined identifier hello" . So its at the point of knowing there are subroutines there, and hisoft saying they are not there. Its stupid. I'm just getting frustrated with it all.

I have almost re-done the test routines for gembench, those are not a problem, pretty easy stuff actually. But writing a GUI in hisoft isn't going to happen. I am wondering about compiling the hisoft tests individually, then just writing the GUI In STOS, then call the tests as machine code routines as a work around. It's not pretty, but I don't see many ways around it.

A quick fix would just to let each test run one by one and just output the rests on screen , that is easy to do, but looses gembench's GUI and some useful features. The only other option is to just leave GB4 & GB5 as they are and not do any more mods to them.

I'm kinda just totally stuck with it all. I can't mod GB itself anymore as its a huge mess of code where anymore changes breaks the thing, and then, I can't re-write it totally as hisoft is just a pain in the ass to do anything in. The whole idea of BASIC its,well, basic, and really should be easy to use, thats the whole idea of it. But this is really driving me nuts! :evil:

I might take a look at ST BASIC, I think I have that somewhere. Hisoft manual says its pretty much compatible. As if it will be easier or not I don't know. But is there any other Basic's out there for writing GEM apps ? If not then some choices will have to be made. That if I produce "GB6" then it really is just going to be a loop of all the tests and the results at the end of it. I find it useful to be able to select single tests, that could be done in a menu, but anything more than that seems to be getting into huge masses of code. So IMHO, its not worth spending huge amounts of time on it.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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Keep trying. Don't give up! (...from a non-programmer ;-) ) Any news mate?
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

I've not had time to work on this due to a million other things going on :( I might have mentioned in another post somewhere that I am totally re-writing gembench from the ground up, though its not high up on my to do list. I have re-programed all the test routines and they all work , though I have little idea on how to program in hisoft basic and every little thing to work out is a huge undertaking :( I will get there in the end, but probably be a "next year" project.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by jfl »

exxos wrote:I might take a look at ST BASIC, I think I have that somewhere. Hisoft manual says its pretty much compatible. As if it will be easier or not I don't know. But is there any other Basic's out there for writing GEM apps ?
Did you forget GFA? You won't find a better Basic for the Atari. As for ST Basic, it's bad reputation is well deserved.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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I used hi soft basic as that is what gembench was created in , so porting its functions to a new app would go quicker. Its doable to finish it without to much bother, just will take a lot of time. I have the CF hard drive to debug, the CPU boosters to debug, a couple other projects which I haven't even mentioned anything about yet. I am constantly getting emails from people all around the world asking for help with stuff, I am trying to divert some over to here as everything I put I basically end up repeating to other people, but not many do come here, plus various things on our house which need finishing before the winter, plus my shed which I started 2 years ago and still not had time to finish, plus my day job, and more of a priority I need to fix my mail server. So doing gembench 6 isn't high up on my to do list right now :)

As for some small news.

Frank wrote a fractal routine to test the FPU out to replace the gembench one, problem is for the ST, it takes forever to draw the screen, so undecided what to do about that currently. Probably just put a option to skip the test. With a FPU is takes about 10 seconds to render the screen.

All the test routines have been re-done, they behave and look very similar to the original tests. Though most tests now run longer due to faster machines like the CT60 etc. Some tests went so fast that the actual % results went a bit crazy on some setups. So they had to be made to run a bit longer. This makes it a bit more daunting on the ST, but it is the slowest machine anyway.

BTW GB5 was actually abandoned which is why I am totally re-writing it, the new one will be GB6. Once I have something run-able I will open up a new thread, but I am unlikely to have time to spend on it any time soon due to higher priorities right now :) But don't worry folks, its not abandoned. Most probably be able to get something workable in the new year :)
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by exxos »

As a "update" GB503 will not run on the Falcon it seems. It fails on the GEM WINDOW test. I posted here about the issue http://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=72&t=29041. I think its just more motivation to work on GB6.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by karlm »

frank.lukas wrote:I use a MC68010 CPU and Gembench 5 bombs with three bombs at the FPU test ...
I think there's your problem - Ja, das ist, wo Ihr Problem ist Frank

Hmmm... the 68010 was a 68000 with fixes? Mainly used in *nix workstations? Hence the added Virtual Memory additions (bus faults, etc)

It fixes several small flaws in the 68000, and adds a few features. The 68010 was pin-compatible with the 68000, but was not 100% software compatible. Some of the differences were:

The MOVE from SR instruction is privileged (it may only be executed in supervisor mode). This means that the 68010 meets Popek and Goldberg virtualization requirements. Because the 68000 offers an unprivileged MOVE from SR, it does not.
The MOVE from CCR instruction was added to partially compensate for the removal of the user-mode MOVE from SR.
It can recover from bus faults, allowing it to implement virtual memory.
The exception stack frame was different.
It introduced a vector base register (VBR), which allowed the vector jump table to be anywhere in RAM.

Additionally, the 68010 had a "loop mode", which could be considered a tiny and special-case instruction cache, which accelerates loops that consist of only 2 instructions.

In practice, the overall speed gain compared to the 68000 at the same frequency was less than 10%.

Motorola 68451 MMU
The 68010 could be used with the 68451 MMU. However, problems with the design, such as a 1 clock memory access penalty, made this configuration unpopular. Some vendors such as Sun Microsystems used their own MMU design in their Sun-2 workstation.

The 68010 was never as popular as the 68000. However, due to the 68010's small speed boost over the 68000 and its support for virtual memory it can be found in a number of smaller Unix systems, both with the 68451 MMU (for example in the Torch Triple X), and with a custom MMU (such as the Sun-2 Workstation, AT&T UNIX PC, the NCR Tower XP and early HP9000s like the Model 300 and 310) and various research machines.
Most other vendors waited for the 68020 instead. Occasionally, owners of Amiga and Atari ST computers and Sega Genesis game consoles replaced their system's 68000 CPU with a 68010 to gain a small speed boost
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by karlm »

exxos wrote:I might take a look at ST BASIC, I think I have that somewhere. Hisoft manual says its pretty much compatible. As if it will be easier or not I don't know.
I'm not a religious man, but please ... for the love of God ... NO!
Trust me, it's not worth resurrecting the floppy.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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karlm wrote:
exxos wrote:I might take a look at ST BASIC, I think I have that somewhere. Hisoft manual says its pretty much compatible. As if it will be easier or not I don't know.
I'm not a religious man, but please ... for the love of God ... NO!
Trust me, it's not worth resurrecting the floppy.
This thread is somewhat old now :) ST basic and some other basics just looked "bad". I went with hisoft basic 2 in the end, it was best to use as that is what GB4 was programmed in, so I could have a head start on programming GB6. At least I have some code to use as examples, almost nobody has any clue about how to program in basic anymore, so I have to work everything out myself pretty much :roll:

I probably said before somewhere, but GB5 is abandoned. I'm re-coding it to from the ground up to GB6. I'm putting in lots of comments and trying to document stuff.. I plan to make it open source once finished, so if anyone wants to make changes to it later then they can do so. Though its unlikely anyone is going to be programming in hisoft basic in the future anyway.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

Post by rpineau »

"The MOVE from SR instruction is privileged " -> same as the 68020 ... so requires TOS 2.06 and up.
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Re: GEMBENCH 5 COMING SOON

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