Hey ijor, I think the games requires a 386 but I'm unsure. At the very least, the original manuals/boxes all demand 386 hardware and onward.ijor wrote:Are most of this titles 16-bit DOS games than run on real mode? Or they actually require a 386, or Win95? Because otherwise I assume it should be a faster 8086 core perhaps.nightshadowpt wrote:I believe you're having too high expectations from this core... A486, despite his name, is more suitable as a 286 or 386SX computer, not a 486.
Games until 1991 should be more or less ok, but after that it may be challenging for this core.
Would love this core to one day run like a proper 486, but until then, enjoy the older titles...
ao486
Moderators: Mug UK, Zorro 2, spiny, Greenious, Sorgelig, Moderator Team
Re: ao486
Re: ao486
I'll contribute my CONFIG.SYS/AUTOEXEC.BAT.Sbeehive wrote:It'd be great to have a couple of those with a working list of what games work well with what config.sys settings. Right now it is a bit unclear (at least to people that aren't advanced DOS users) as to how well you can get certain games to run under ideal conditions.Newsdee wrote:Would be a good idea to keep one or two config.sys in the repository as reference. Its easy to forget some of the obscure settings
It won't disappoint as it is loaded full obscure and esoteric setting.
Anyway, it has a boot menu:
1. HIMEM
2. HIMEM_EMM386
3. QEMM
4. QEMM_SOFTMPU
5. QEMM_IRQ_SOFTMPU
Options #5 and #6 are only if you want to use a USB MIDI device (or emulation)
Maybe we could agree on common CONFIG/AUTOEXEC file and then maintain a list that which # works best for whatever game?
CONFIG.SYS:
Code: Select all
[MENU]
MENUITEM=HIMEM
MENUITEM=HIMEM_EMM386
MENUITEM=QEMM
MENUITEM=QEMM_SOFTMPU
MENUITEM=QEMM_IRQ_SOFTMPU
[HIMEM]
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
[HIMEM_EMM386]
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
DEVICEHIGH=C:\DOS\EMM386.EXE NOEMS X=A000-C7FF I=C800-EFFF
[QEMM]
device=c:\qemm\dosdata.sys
device=c:\qemm\qemm386.sys ram aram=c800-dfff r:1
device=c:\qemm\dos-up.sys @c:\qemm\dos-up.dat
[QEMM_SOFTMPU]
device=c:\qemm\dosdata.sys
device=c:\qemm\qemm386.sys ram aram=c800-dfff r:1
device=c:\qemm\dos-up.sys @c:\qemm\dos-up.dat
[QEMM_IRQ_SOFTMPU]
device=c:\qemm\dosdata.sys
device=c:\qemm\qemm386.sys ram aram=c800-dfff r:1
device=c:\qemm\dos-up.sys @c:\qemm\dos-up.dat
[COMMON]
DOS=HIGH
FILES=50
BUFFERS=50
LASTDRIVE=Z
DEVICE=C:\DOS\MOUSE.SYS
rem SHELL=C:\COMMAND.COM C:\ /P
Code: Select all
@ECHO OFF
set BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 T2
PATH=C:\;C:\DOS;C:\QEMM
GOTO %CONFIG%
:QEMM
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:2 /RES=4272 /SQT=FC00-FCFF DOSKEY
GOTO END
:QEMM_SOFTMPU
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:1 C:\SOFTMPU\SOFTMPU /MPU:330 /OUTPUT:COM1
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:2 /RES=4272 /SQT=FC00-FCFF DOSKEY
GOTO END
:QEMM_IRQ_SOFTMPU
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:1 C:\SOFTMPU\SOFTMPU /SB:220 /IRQ:5 /MPU:330 /OUTPUT:COM1
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:2 /RES=4272 /SQT=FC00-FCFF DOSKEY
GOTO END
:HIMEM
:HIMEM_EMM386
DOSKEY
:END
Re: ao486
Fantastic! I found some similar example but they are not necessarily current for MiSTer usage.
It's a shame that DOS 6 isn't freely available, otherwise we could package a VHD ready for use with that and maybe a couple of demo/shareware/PD games. I'ver never tried FreeDOS so not sure that is a viable alternative. Has anybody got any experience with it? Is it worth doing?
At the same time, setting up a DOS VHD is not hard. New users could just follow step by step instructions on the wiki for setup.
It's a shame that DOS 6 isn't freely available, otherwise we could package a VHD ready for use with that and maybe a couple of demo/shareware/PD games. I'ver never tried FreeDOS so not sure that is a viable alternative. Has anybody got any experience with it? Is it worth doing?
At the same time, setting up a DOS VHD is not hard. New users could just follow step by step instructions on the wiki for setup.
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Re: ao486
Main compatibility issues with games under FreeDos is MSCDEX.EXE and CD-detection/anti-piracy methods of the time, which shouldn't be an issue as ao486 cannot mount ISOs. And... actually, FreeDos has a tool to mount ISOs, only problem is that it doesn't support audio tracks (on top of the compatibility issues).Newsdee wrote:Fantastic! I found some similar example but they are not necessarily current for MiSTer usage.
It's a shame that DOS 6 isn't freely available, otherwise we could package a VHD ready for use with that and maybe a couple of demo/shareware/PD games. I'ver never tried FreeDOS so not sure that is a viable alternative. Has anybody got any experience with it? Is it worth doing?
At the same time, setting up a DOS VHD is not hard. New users could just follow step by step instructions on the wiki for setup.
Here's my ao486 boot config, might help somebody:
autoexec.bat
Code: Select all
@ECHO OFF
PROMPT $p$g
SET TEMP=C:\DOS
SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 T4 P330
REM ***** Check the paths below, you might want to remove/adjust some of them
PATH C:\WINDOWS;C:\QEMM;C:\DOS;C:\UTIL\NC;C:\UTIL\PCTOOLS;C:\UTIL\PKWARE
GOTO %config%
:QEMM386WIN
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:1 /LO C:\WINDOWS\SMARTDRV.EXE /X
:QEMM386
REM C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:2 /RES=1760 /SQT=FC00-FCFF C:\UTIL\4DOS\KSTACK.COM
C:\QEMM\LOADHI /R:2 /LO C:\UTIL\START\CTMOUSE.EXE
GOTO END
:EMM386
REM ***** 4DOS 8.00 is installed in C:\UTIL\4DOS
LH C:\UTIL\4DOS\KSTACK.COM
LH C:\WINDOWS\SMARTDRV.EXE /X
:EMS
:HIMEM
REM ***** CTMouse is copied to C:\UTIL\MOUSE
LH C:\UTIL\MOUSE\CTMOUSE.EXE
:END
Code: Select all
[common]
BUFFERS=10,0
FILES=30
DOS=UMB
LASTDRIVE=E
FCBS=4,0
DOS=HIGH
REM ***** 4DOS 8.00 is installed in C:\UTIL\4DOS
SHELL=C:\UTIL\4DOS\4DOS.COM C:\UTIL\4DOS\ /P
STACKS=9,256
[menu]
menuitem=QEMM386, QEMM XMS+EMS - 630K Dos Optimized
menuitem=QEMM386WIN, QEMM XMS+EMS - 616K Windows 3.1 Optimized
menuitem=EMS, EMM386 XMS+EMS - 607K Dos Optimized
menuitem=EMM386, EMM386 XMS - 613K Windows 3.1 Optimized
menuitem=HIMEM, No memory manager - 615K
menudefault=QEMM386,5
[QEMM386]
device=c:\qemm\dosdata.sys
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\QEMM386.SYS RAM ROM ST:F ARAM=C800-DFFF R:2
device=c:\qemm\dos-up.sys @c:\qemm\dos-up.dat
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\LOADHI.SYS /R:1 /SIZE=9872 C:\QEMM\QDPMI.SYS SWAPFILE=DPMI.SWP SWAPSIZE=1024
[QEMM386WIN]
device=c:\qemm\dosdata.sys
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\QEMM386.SYS RAM ROM ST:F ARAM=C800-DFFF R:2
device=c:\qemm\dos-up.sys @c:\qemm\dos-up.dat
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\LOADHI.SYS /R:1 /SIZE=9872 C:\QEMM\QDPMI.SYS SWAPFILE=DPMI.SWP SWAPSIZE=1024
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\LOADHI.SYS /R:1 /SIZE=14032 C:\DOS\SETVER.EXE
DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\SMARTDRV.EXE /DOUBLE_BUFFER
DEVICE=C:\QEMM\LOADHI.SYS /R:1 /SIZE=4848 C:\WINDOWS\IFSHLP.SYS
[EMS]
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
DEVICEHIGH=C:\DOS\EMM386.EXE i=E000-EFFF x=B000-B7FF /NOTR
[EMM386]
DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\SMARTDRV.EXE /DOUBLE_BUFFER
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
REM DEVICEHIGH=C:\DOS\EMM386.EXE i=E000-EFFF i=B000-B7FF NOEMS
DEVICEHIGH=C:\DOS\EMM386.EXE i=E000-EFFF x=B000-B7FF NOEMS /NOTR
DEVICEHIGH=C:\DOS\SETVER.EXE
DEVICEHIGH=C:\WINDOWS\IFSHLP.SYS
[HIMEM]
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
- I'm using QEMM386 7.5
- I'm using 4DOS v8.00, "Free 4DOS" from here: https://www.4dos.info/v4dos.htm (linux-style autocomplete and much more)
If somebody wants a basic config for 4DOS:
4dos.ini
Code: Select all
[4DOS]
InstallPath = C:\UTIL\4DOS\
COLORDIR=DIRS:cya;SYSTEM:bri whi on red;HIDDEN:whi on red;RDONLY:whi on blu;EXE COM:gre;BAT BTM CMD :bri gre;QWK REP ZIP ARC LZH ARJ PQI:bri yel;HLP CFG CNF CTL A O SO OBJ DLL INI DAT HLP SES ION LOG RC OS2 OPT PIF:red;SYS DRV OVL:bri red;DOC C CC CPP CXX H TXT ME 1ST NOT ASC LET:bri whi;JPG BMP GIF PNG ICO TIF TGA:mag;AVI MOV MPG MP3 WAV MID:bri mag;IPF INF MAN PDF HTM HTML:bri cya;RAR TGZ:yel;*~ BAK:bri bla;DIZ:bla on yel
EditMode = Insert
CursorIns = 15
CursorOver = 100
BrightBG=Yes
AppendToDir=Yes
Mouse=Yes
Win95SFNSearch=No
This should replicate the insert behaviour of modern shells, the same cursor size for insert mode, some nice colours for different kinds of files/folders and some other tweaks.
- Eero Tamminen
- Fuji Shaped Bastard
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Re: ao486
DOS doesn't do much. I thing FreeDOS should work fine with almost everything. It's supposed to be better than original DOS in some respects:Newsdee wrote: It's a shame that DOS 6 isn't freely available, otherwise we could package a VHD ready for use with that and maybe a couple of demo/shareware/PD games. I'ver never tried FreeDOS so not sure that is a viable alternative. Has anybody got any experience with it? Is it worth doing?
http://wiki.freedos.org/wiki/index.php/ ... _better.3F
(I've used it quite a bit for playing DOS games on Linux, but that was nearly 20 years ago.)
Most of the issue you would encounter would probably be be installing the things, but one could do that on another setup and just copy things to FreeDOS setup.
FreeDOS site itself also seems to offer few free games:
http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/micro/pc-stu ... games.html
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- Obsessive compulsive Atari behavior
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- Joined: Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:46 pm
Re: ao486
OK, I got DOS 6.22 installed and created a 2GB VHD for the DOS partition. I copied over a bunch of old DOS game directories and things load great right off. BUT, everything runs too fast! Is this like DOSBox where you have to slow the core down somehow for the older titles?
Re: ao486
there is no such feature. I think there should be some DOS TSR utilities for slowing down.
Re: ao486
Never noticed the too fast aspect of the core. Most programs I use are on the slow side of things. However, in former times most of these machine had a "turbo" button on the front. Deactivating the "turbo" meant down-clocking the cpu by half or more. That was used to slow thing down. This was really only necessary for original PC software running on the original IBM PC. I personally never used it - but I starter using MS-DOS with 5.0. So most software was adjusted for faster machines.bitfan2011 wrote:OK, I got DOS 6.22 installed and created a 2GB VHD for the DOS partition. I copied over a bunch of old DOS game directories and things load great right off. BUT, everything runs too fast! Is this like DOSBox where you have to slow the core down somehow for the older titles?
Still hope the ao486 gets a co-processor and SVGA output someday. In its current state it still is only have the machine that I was used too back then...

Still a great core and one of the most used ones by me.

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- Obsessive compulsive Atari behavior
- Posts: 112
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Re: ao486
Yeah, even "newer" titles seem to almost be in fast-forward, like an intro will skip screens too fast to read anything. I don't mean 3D titles like DOOM, I haven't tested those out because I heard those were slow. Older stuff goes at warp speed. ALF is an example - The game runs so fast that the enemies in the maze move like hummingbirds.NegSol wrote:Never noticed the too fast aspect of the core. Most programs I use are on the slow side of things. However, in former times most of these machine had a "turbo" button on the front. Deactivating the "turbo" meant down-clocking the cpu by half or more. That was used to slow thing down. This was really only necessary for original PC software running on the original IBM PC. I personally never used it - but I starter using MS-DOS with 5.0. So most software was adjusted for faster machines.bitfan2011 wrote:OK, I got DOS 6.22 installed and created a 2GB VHD for the DOS partition. I copied over a bunch of old DOS game directories and things load great right off. BUT, everything runs too fast! Is this like DOSBox where you have to slow the core down somehow for the older titles?
Still hope the ao486 gets a co-processor and SVGA output someday. In its current state it still is only have the machine that I was used too back then...![]()
Still a great core and one of the most used ones by me.
Re: ao486
Maybe down-clocking could be arranged for those early title. But again - I am not the target audience for this 
Take a look at the following link - those tsr programs could serve your need for slowness.
https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?t=44

Take a look at the following link - those tsr programs could serve your need for slowness.
https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?t=44
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- Obsessive compulsive Atari behavior
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Re: ao486
It seems like I just had bad luck with choosing older titles, I have now tried others which run at normal speed. So cool to get back into DOS games from my distant youth.NegSol wrote:Maybe down-clocking could be arranged for those early title. But again - I am not the target audience for this
Take a look at the following link - those tsr programs could serve your need for slowness.
https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?t=44
Re: ao486
There is another X86 core which can be ported to MiSTer and be used for even older apps/games.
It just in lowest priority to me. Any one else is welcome to port.
It just in lowest priority to me. Any one else is welcome to port.
Re: ao486
This was a common issue with DOS. You can try the slowdown utilities listed here:bitfan2011 wrote: It seems like I just had bad luck with choosing older titles, I have now tried others which run at normal speed. So cool to get back into DOS games from my distant youth.
https://www.vogons.org/viewtopic.php?t=44
Re: a0486
So, did anybody look into the other "open" cores? zet86, v586 or net180?Sorgelig wrote:The ao486 core has been written specially with worst CPU implementation. 3D graphics hasn't been included for the same purpose - make users to suffer and cry.
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- Atarian
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Re: ao486
Did somebody managed to figure out how to get the joystick to work in ao486?
Re: ao486
There is no joystick support for ao486.
Almost all PC games of that time were written for keyboard.
You can map joystick to keyboard.
Almost all PC games of that time were written for keyboard.
You can map joystick to keyboard.
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Re: ao486: what do you use to transfer files?
I'm just using Disk Management for Win 7. Top menu lets you create a VHD and mount it within Windows. Then you can format before dumping files on. Unmount the VHD using the same menu. I keep the 2GB FAT VHD mounted as the primary drive in ao486 core, with the DOS 6.22 install disk #1 IMG also mounted. If I change the boot priority to FDD first, I can reinstall DOS 6.22 easily. I also created a secondary 2GB VHD for more games that would not fit on the primary VHD. I keep that mounted as secondary VHD in ao486.
Re: ao486
Does anyone else's ao486 crash constantly on either startup or DOS?
For some reason my core crashes almost all the time. Especially when trying to use CTMOUSE. Sometimes it will just start and report a fatal error with the mouse.
I'm also wondering if it is because of my QEMM shenanigans. Or perhaps the micro-sd card I use is causing this (Sandisk)?
About 2 of 5 times I can get the core to work perfectly just by retrying.
For some reason my core crashes almost all the time. Especially when trying to use CTMOUSE. Sometimes it will just start and report a fatal error with the mouse.
I'm also wondering if it is because of my QEMM shenanigans. Or perhaps the micro-sd card I use is causing this (Sandisk)?
About 2 of 5 times I can get the core to work perfectly just by retrying.
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Re: ao486
I don't remember now what version I'm using, but try ctmouse versions 1.9 or 2.0 to see if it helps. Depending on the machine I have had to choose between versions, and this includes real 90s hardware.Sbeehive wrote:Does anyone else's ao486 crash constantly on either startup or DOS?
For some reason my core crashes almost all the time. Especially when trying to use CTMOUSE. Sometimes it will just start and report a fatal error with the mouse.
I'm also wondering if it is because of my QEMM shenanigans. Or perhaps the micro-sd card I use is causing this (Sandisk)?
About 2 of 5 times I can get the core to work perfectly just by retrying.
Also, QEMM and any other memory manager (EMM386, JEMMEX) can cause issues due to the way in which the RAM between 640 and 1MB is mapped by this BIOS. For example, in my case all floppy access will be corrupted in certain scenarios, so I would avoid using a memory manager unless you are short in base memory and need to "loadhigh" TSRs, or a game really needs EMS. For this same reason is impossible to play Ultima VII with ao486 (which includes its own memory manager).
Re: ao486
Thanks for the reply. I'll definitely try a different version of CTMOUSE.glaucon1984 wrote:I don't remember now what version I'm using, but try ctmouse versions 1.9 or 2.0 to see if it helps. Depending on the machine I have had to choose between versions, and this includes real 90s hardware.Sbeehive wrote:Does anyone else's ao486 crash constantly on either startup or DOS?
For some reason my core crashes almost all the time. Especially when trying to use CTMOUSE. Sometimes it will just start and report a fatal error with the mouse.
I'm also wondering if it is because of my QEMM shenanigans. Or perhaps the micro-sd card I use is causing this (Sandisk)?
About 2 of 5 times I can get the core to work perfectly just by retrying.
Also, QEMM and any other memory manager (EMM386, JEMMEX) can cause issues due to the way in which the RAM between 640 and 1MB is mapped by this BIOS. For example, in my case all floppy access will be corrupted in certain scenarios, so I would avoid using a memory manager unless you are short in base memory and need to "loadhigh" TSRs, or a game really needs EMS. For this same reason is impossible to play Ultima VII with ao486 (which includes its own memory manager).
Yeah I got Ultima Underworld 1 + 2 working using QEMM shockingly enough. It runs like a slide-show on high-detail, but I was impressed it runs at all. The mouse isn't effected so it is quite playable.
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- Captain Atari
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Re: ao486
Yes, exact same scenario here. But haven't investigated further.Sbeehive wrote:Does anyone else's ao486 crash constantly on either startup or DOS?
For some reason my core crashes almost all the time. Especially when trying to use CTMOUSE. Sometimes it will just start and report a fatal error with the mouse.
I'm also wondering if it is because of my QEMM shenanigans. Or perhaps the micro-sd card I use is causing this (Sandisk)?
About 2 of 5 times I can get the core to work perfectly just by retrying.
Two beer or not two beer? - Shakesbeer.
Re: ao486
I've mentioned earlier that crash usually happens when i press any key while PC booting. Probably some interrupts happened while it should be disabled.