STOS BASIC CURRENT NEWS & INFORMATION 2015

[exxos]

Posted here will be all the latest STOS news and updates. If you have any STOS source code, demos, examples, anything STOS related which isn't currently on the STOS website, then please send me a PM and I will include it on future site updates. If you know of any STOS related websites, then please let me know and I will post the links


27th Jan 2015 - NEW WEBSITE HOME
The new home for stos.atari.st is now http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/

The old original STOS sites are no longer maintained. All the information , plus lots more, is going on my new site as listed above. We now have a huge amount of games, demos, source code online


9th March 2014 - NEW STOS COMPILER VERSION V3.00

STOS1904.zip

Build 19th April 2014
Petari has kindly spent a lot of time fixing the STOS compiler to allow compiled programs to run on any TOS versions without the need for patching afterwards. The second bit of good news, is that while the latest official version of the compiler was 2.7, which only seems to have been available with the STOS 3D package, has since been updated with the assembly source code of version 208 which was posted by Francois Lionet on the Click Team's website some years ago. This is great news as we now have the updated V2.8 source, which has further been updated by petari creating version 3.00!

I have also fixed some bugs in the compiler ACB and updated to suit the new V3.00 compiler. I have also added in a quick help section to explain what the options are in the compiler. A new final version of STOS for the ST will be available for download when the new site goes live.

A separate version of STOS will be available in the future which is intended for the Falcon030. This STOS version will include Falcon only extensions which will support the Falcon's video modes, and make use of the DSP. There are 100's of new commands, too many to list!


10th MARCH 2014 - NEW STOS PATCHER
New universal STOSFIX patcher by Petari - http://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=71&t=26228#p249132
Petari has kindly spent some days creating a new universal STOS patcher program to fix any PRG compiled STOS programs. There is now no need to use any of the older STOSFIX programs which are limited and no longer supported. Petari's patcher will adapt the PRG's to work on any TOS version, past and future, without the need to re-patch the PRG for other variations of TOS.

[exxos]

A lot of page pages are changing about at the moment, I will just update the first post here with current information. I will post progress in this thread also.

I had to fiddle a lot of my pages around to keep the STOS pages separate from the hardware pages for example. So if any of my pages seemed to have vanished, please go back to the main index listed below...

The new homepage for my site will be http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/ The page is now up, but not 100% working link wise yet..

The main STOS page is http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/STOS_index.htm

If any pages go corrupted or graphics for the next few days, then just assume I am updating them for now. Someone is bound to try a page while I am uploading a new copy or something

I still have a lot of files to sort though, but will keep adding stuff as and when. Thanks to MUGUK for sending/posting some files I had not seen before (be it over a year ago now). All those files are now online

There was some "STOS PACKS" . A lot were just stuff which was already online, like the Missing Link extension. So I have sorted though them, and 100's of other images and either split the files up, or in some cases just uploaded the pack as a zip.

I have tried to put as much info into the source code & extensions page as I can. Though while some things were separate, and kept that way, I can't go though every BAS file and document what it does and what it needs to run, that would create thousands of hours of work. So There are a few "source code packs" where its pretty much pot luck which is in those files. I have have stack of floppies to sort though. Though if anyone has any files not listed currently then please let me know and I will add it into my "to sort" pile.

Dawn has pretty much done all 6 of the STOS GAMES pages herself. Including taking screenshots and sorting out the files etc. The file list for the games was taken from AL. As the site is in disarray at the moment, Dawn found the vast majority of the games on Marcers game DVD2.

There is a lot of source code and tutorials in STOSSER and MEGA DISKZINE. I will be uploading all those later in the week, along with some other diskmags & book scans.

BTW - if anyone knows a good image to pdf program can you let me know. I tried loads of them off the net. ended up with 2 viruses also. Half the programs do not let you set the page order, they seem to just assume they are numbers from 1 - 300 or whatever. Half of them do the stupid trick of adding page 1, then page 10 kinda thing. So anything which does not let me set the order is pointless really. Also hardly any let you set pdf options like compression or anything. It just seems madness that there does not seem to be any programs which actually have any sort of what I would call, basic features

[shoggoth]

I once had a look at the STOS sources with the intention of making it less OS-unfriendly. A clean STOS implementation would be nice, and I believe most of it could be done without sacrificing performance.

Any thoughts?

[CiH]

Is there anything more about the Falcon specific version that was mentioned before?

[exxos]

I once had a look at the STOS sources with the intention of making it less OS-unfriendly. A clean STOS implementation would be nice, and I believe most of it could be done without sacrificing performance.

Any thoughts?

STOS does/should run on ST/Falcon. I was working on my STOS game which was done in STOS on the falcon, way before it started even getting patched. The only issue I am really aware of is that it should be loaded in a ST resolution. So not sure what you are getting at with a "clean implementation" ?

I think there was a issue with it loading on some TOS versions. Though I think that was fixed. AFAIK the STOS loader in my zip should be the final version. At least the latest one which was patched that actually worked. I think if it was run in Falcon resolution, it wouldn't quit to the desktop correctly, the desktop would just blur out yellow. But its not a huge issue.

[exxos]

Is there anything more about the Falcon specific version that was mentioned before?

The ST version which is on the site will work on the Falcon, just I have not yet added the STOS extensions for the Falcon yet, though they should be floating about somewhere. I will try and add the pack on the site when I find the stuff again. I did start going though the examples for the extensions, but a lot of them do not work as the extensions got updated, it broke the early examples. So that was the only real hold up on the Falcon version. I will try and get the Falcon extensions sorted for it later this week

[shoggoth]

STOS does/should run on ST/Falcon. I was working on my STOS game which was done in STOS on the falcon, way before it started even getting patched. The only issue I am really aware of is that it should be loaded in a ST resolution. So not sure what you are getting at with a "clean implementation" ?

Clean as in "doesn't require single-TOS". I got the impression that the author envisioned it as some kind of OS replacement + integrated basic rather than a basic + games toolkit.

[Marcer]

Just a question. Cant you compile all those stos games and put online? I have quite tons as a feeling atleast with stos games in sources. I can send them to you

[Marcer]

Or is there any stand a lone compiler?

[exxos]

There is 300 games online which are already compiled (but unfortunately no source code) http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/STOS/GAMES/games1.htm (6 pages of them) These game off your DVD2. I used the AL index to filter just the STOS games out from your DVD.

There is also a small page with some games but mostly source code. Those games are not really full or finished games so no point in compiling them as stand alone games.
http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/STOS/GAMES_SRC/STOS_GAMES.htm

Do you have any other files not currently online then ? I can compile the compiler if it helps Though I think such source code should be kept as source code. STOS is of course creating games not just playing them

[Marcer]

I have other games reason why I ask.

[exxos]

I have other games reason why I ask.

Nice Can you put them on a folder on your FTP and I can sort them and add them to my pages ?

[Eero Tamminen]

There is 300 games online which are already compiled (but unfortunately no source code) http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/STOS/GAMES/games1.htm (6 pages of them)

A lot of them, most of them something I don't remember ever seeing before... So, what are your favorites?

[exxos]

I used to like Square off and dungeonz. They were puzzle type games. A lot of those games I have not seen before myself. I was more programming and creating stuff than playing games. Though "back in the day" I was limited to floppyshop PD stuff.

[exxos]

STOS does/should run on ST/Falcon. I was working on my STOS game which was done in STOS on the falcon, way before it started even getting patched. The only issue I am really aware of is that it should be loaded in a ST resolution. So not sure what you are getting at with a "clean implementation" ?

Clean as in "doesn't require single-TOS". I got the impression that the author envisioned it as some kind of OS replacement + integrated basic rather than a basic + games toolkit.

Interesting, I just found this snippet in TG's FAQ...

The name of STOS is coming from ST Operating System. The first version of STOS included a complete DOS-like operating system, a Forth,a 68000 Assembler and BPL a Batch programming language. The idea was to eventually create 2 more Languages for AMIGA and PC. AMOS for AMIGA Operating System and PCOS for PC Operating System.

So there could be some truth in it..

[exxos]

More content on most of the pages. I have started to add the dates on the pages now, so the date will update automatically. I have fixed no end of broken links also. AFAIK there shouldn't be any broken links.

I should have the STOS related, & programming related zines up tomorrow.

I will try and sort out the Falcon STOS stuff later today. Though I can't try it out as my Falcon is in bits. I can't remember if the STOS loader was fixed for the Falcon, at least not correctly.

It might be useful if someone can check the ST STOS out on a falcon and see what happens. The bugs were the old TOS tables thing where the mouse and keyboard would not work correctly. If they did, then it wouldn't go back to desktop correctly. So the 208 loader might need updating (not something I can do myself).

[exxos]

Code: Select all

**************************************************************************
*                                                                        *
*           Falcon - STOS Basic Extensions Suite Update Disk.            *
*                                                                        *
*                          14/04/98                                      *
*                                                                        *
**************************************************************************

                 This disk contains the following files:


   Path/File          Size       File Info

A:\UPDATES\STOS\*.*
   STARS   .EXH        7,158  ST(e)/TT/Falcon STARS extension.
   3D_MENU .EXU       15,553  ST(e)/TT/Falcon 3D Menu & Alerts extension.
   GEM_TXT .EXL       14,407  ST(e)/TT/Falcon Gemtext extension.
   SYS_CTRL.EXW       35,572  ST(e)/TT/Falcon SYSTEM CONTROL extension.
   FALC_VID.EXX       15,462  Falcon 030 VIDEO (III) extension.
   FALCGFX3.EXV       12,913  Falcon 030 GRAFIX (III) extension [this ext-
                              ensions 'multipen' commands are compatible
                              with ST's].

   FALC_FLI.EXQ        2,712  Falcon 030 FLI/FLC Player Extension v0.25
   FALC_SND.EXY        6,691  Falcon 030 DMA SOUND Extension V2.2
   FALC_MOD.EXZ       11,730  Falcon 030 DSP Tracker Extension v2.87

   SPRIT101.BIN       59,431  A  specially patched version of  the  SPRITE
                              manager interpreter  library file  [contains
                              vital   support  routines  for  the   SYSTEM
                              CONTROL,  3D Menu & Alerts,  VIDEO (III) and
                              GRAFIX (III) extensions].

   WINDO102.BIN       22,942  A  specially patched version of  the  WINDOW
                              manager interpreter  library file  [contains
                              vital   support  routines  for  the   SYSTEM
                              CONTROL and 3D Menu & Alerts extensions].

   MUSIC101.BIN       11,946  A  specially  patched version of  the  MUSIC
                              manager interpreter  library file  [contains
                              vital  support  routines for the DSP Tracker
                              Player extension].

 
A:\UPDATES\COMPILER\*.*
   STARS   .ECH        7,415  ST(e)/TT/Falcon STARS extension.
   3D_MENU .ECU        1,264  ST(e)/TT/Falcon 3D Menu & Alerts extension.
   GEM_TXT .ECL        5,820  ST(e)/TT/Falcon Gemtext extension.
   SYS_CTRL.ECW        7,282  ST(e)/TT/Falcon SYSTEM CONTROL extension.
   FALC_VID.ECX       22,329  Falcon 030 VIDEO (III) extension.
   FALCGFX3.ECV       12,750  Falcon 030 GRAFIX (III) extension [this ext-
                              ensions 'multipen' commands are compatible
                              with ST's].

   FALC_FLI.ECQ        2,888  Falcon 030 FLI/FLC Player Extension v0.25
   FALC_SND.ECY        4,780  Falcon 030 DMA SOUND Extension V2.2
   FALC_MOD.ECZ       10,532  Falcon 030 DSP Tracker Extension v2.87

   SPRIT101.LIB       58,955  A  specially patched version of  the  SPRITE
                              manager  compiler  library  file   [contains
                              vital   support  routines  for  the   SYSTEM
                              CONTROL,  3D Menu & Alerts,  VIDEO (III) and
                              GRAFIX (III) extensions].

   WINDO102.LIB       28,186  A  specially patched version of  the  WINDOW
                              manager  compiler  library  file   [contains
                              vital   support  routines  for  the   SYSTEM
                              CONTROL and 3D Menu & Alerts extensions].

   MUSIC101.LIB       18,049  A  specially  patched version of  the  MUSIC
                              manager  compiler  library  file   [contains
                              vital  support  routines for the DSP Tracker
                              Player extension].

As far as I can find, those were the last registered versions of the extensions I received.

The thing is, the STOS DRAW commands would not work reliably on the Falcon (or at all) so AH wrote replacement DRAW commands into his extensions which remained backward compatible with the ST. So any programs using the STOS DRAW commands, should simply use the AH extension ones instead. The problem here is, it makes STOS itself a lot larger as it has to be shipped with the entire extension suite and patched STOS files.

The ST one is really a cut down "simple" version without all the patches. Ideally STOS itself should be fixed to work on the Falcon, but that would be a task for someone else. At least that way. the STOS DRAW commands could be used on ST or falcon, without having to ship the entire extension pack along with it. It seems a little pointless shipping the Falcon extensions along with larger files, if the intention is to only use ST related commands.

So there is a choice to be made..

1) Someone will have to patch STOS to fix the DRAW functions, this way there can just be one version of STOS which will work on ST or Falcon, and the Falcon extensions go separately.

2) The whole Falcon updates get shipped with STOS making it larger, and people will have to use the new DRAW commands in the extension. Then this version of STOS becomes the same copy for ST and Falcon.

3) Both from above. STOS gets fixed, the updated STOS libs get shipped, but not the extensions by default. This would render the extensions draw commands pointless, but would be easier for coders to use the STOS commands rather than having to use extensions.

IMHO, there should just be one version of STOS. That will work on ST and Falcon. Though IIRC, the entire pack is to large to fit on a single 720K floppy. So if the Falcon way becomes standard, then it may need 1.44 floppy, or to be installed on Hard Drive. This will cause problems for ST uses who only have 720K drives.

I really want to add all the extensions like missing link along in a final version of STOS. Though this will make running STOS impossible to run from floppy anymore. The ST version is small enough to run from floppy, but after falcon updates, not so much.

So there is also a choice if we really need STOS to fit on floppy or not..

I will start with the falcon version, its all I can do. Then I will see what the total size is. Then if there is space, I will add some other extensions like missing link. Really I want to keep this as simple as possible but its not so simple .

[exxos]

I'll assume as no replies about the STOS Falcon version that there is no preference to how it fits together. I will just add the Falcon extensions and patches to the ST copy and that will have to be the falcon version for now. It just probably won't fit on a floppy. I will make a note about the DRAW commands somewhere.

SITE UPDATES
http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/STOS_index.htm

STOS related zines are now up. Some zines cover ASM stuff and things, but as there is STOS content that is fine. I think ASM related stuff is OK too as ASM can be used in STOS aswell anyway.

2 more pages of demos, lots of additions to games, and source code pages etc. There are a few odd files left, but that will have to wait until i get more time, as I want to start on my hardware mods again after the weekend.

[bullis1]

I think those of us who are still tinkering with STOS in 2015 either have mass storage for their ST or are doing this through emulation. Therefore, the too-big-for-floppy distribution of STOS should be just fine.

Thanks for all your efforts exxos

[exxos]

I think those of us who are still tinkering with STOS in 2015 either have mass storage for their ST or are doing this through emulation. Therefore, the too-big-for-floppy distribution of STOS should be just fine.

Thanks for all your efforts exxos

Yeah, though STOS Hatari never runs anything I try to run on it. I have been trying the Falcon STOS examples, they mostly work in steem, though when it comes to DSP stuff, like playing audio, It has to be done on Hatari. Though on there, it just plays audio for a second then crashes with bus error I don't think I have ever got anything to run in Hatari for that matter. Stuff works a fraction better with TOS404 than EMUTOS, but still same result. So I doubt anyone would be doing anything STOS related unless they use a real Falcon. Mine has been on a shelf in bits for years, so its not easy to do STOS Falcon stuff for me at the moment.

There was a lot of examples code done with a previous version of the extensions, Though they would need updating as a lot changed and the old examples won't work with the new extensions. Though that is going to cause a huge problem until I get around to putting my falcon back together. There are some basic examples so all is not at a loss.

F-STOS as I am going to call it, Itself, is about 900K. So it will fit on a Falcon 1.44 floppy if the docs and examples are all removed from the archive. I will have to write a doc myself explaining a few things also.

THE DOWN SIDE:
I also thought there is a huge down side here which I only just un-forgot. While its possible to use 16 colour sprites etc (IIRC) in 256 extended video modes (like I did in my game) the sprites are limited to 16 colours still This goes the same for the missing link extensions. Problem is, while that extension is awesome, for the falcon in 256 colour modes, its going to be somewhat useless Which means while there are a huge set of commands to take advantage of the Falcons hardware, there isn't actually any new sprite or map related functions.

It maybe possible for someone to decompile the missing link, and adapt it for higher screen resolutions and colours, but its not something I could do. There is also the issue of it remaining backwards compatible with the ST stuff.

There would have to probably be a new sprite bank format, new sprite editor to make sure of 256 colour sprites. Note while true-colour is possible, I think the Falcon runs pretty slow in that mode. Also when going via STOS I don't think it would be a usable mode for anything. I can program a new sprite editor to work with 256 colour modes, but I can't do the extensions. I half wonder if the missing link extension should just be redone for the falcon, and not keep compatibility with the ST stuff. Though as a lot of the examples are in ST resolutions, then it could be a problem.

Though what AH did, was take the draw commands like DRAW and do a falcon version called _FALC DRAW. That uses the new extension, but it will also work in ST resolutions and still work on a real ST. I guess the missing link examples could be tweaked to use like _FALC BOB then a "search and replace" could be done on the example to port the code over to the "new missing link" Falcon extensions.

however you look at it, the missing link extension needs to be patched to work on the falcon in extended video modes. Otherwise the Falcon version of STOS is a little pointless. Extensions can make use of the DSP for sound and take advantage of the falcons hardware. Though there is nothing sprite related which is a huge let down

[exxos]

The current build of the STOS Falcon version is now online.

http://www.exxoshost.co.uk/atari/STOSFLOPPY/index.htm

[jvas]

Hi,

Should the Falcon version work with TOS2.06? It gives two bombs in steem. Starts with TOS 1.04...

Thanks,
Jozsi

[exxos]

Works for me. in TOS104, TOS206 in steem ST version, TOS404 in Hatari Falcon version.

It seems the Falcon version does not work in TOS206, Though it should have been backwards compatible. I guess not. So I will change the info on my site that the Falcon version only works on a Falcon with TOS404.

[jvas]

Strange, but works with tos1.04 (falcon version)

[exxos]

Strange, but works with tos1.04 (falcon version)

odd. I guess there could be some bug somewhere. Though not something I can track or fix. Would be a bug in the loader itself or probably one of the patched STOS files.