Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby spiny » Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:50 pm

MrPixel wrote:if i were to ask the mods, what item would i put it under?


if you want this thread deleted, it's unlikely. it's not breaking any rules.

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby Mug UK » Thu Mar 08, 2018 9:53 pm

MrPixel wrote:if i were to ask the mods, what item would i put it under?


You send a message to the Moderators group. The query is discussed and a team approach is decided upon.
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:05 pm

thank you. and spiny, it's for mine

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby spiny » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:18 pm

MrPixel wrote:thank you. and spiny, it's for mine


I refer you to my earlier post.

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby wongck » Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:45 pm

I guess MrPixel just needs to sit down and read a computer programming book from start to end.
Looking at that piece of code, it looks like he does not even understand flow of the program.... (Line 40 & 45).
Well, it's a long way to go....
and BASIC even as it is call Beginner's All-purpose Symbolic Instruction Code... it does not show structured programming, type scoping etc etc to the beginner... may be Pascal would be a better learning language to start with.
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby charles » Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:53 am

I feel its his sub conscious depicting a ever day life of a computer coder...nifty parrallel

mini collossel cave v.2

..look for money
...return to cave
...find door
...sit and write code

I just added a missing is a sub routine
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:54 am

[quote="MrPixel"]i am of the camp that still uses basic and relishes the glory days of coding. when you didn't have to go to class to learn how to program. a computer, a book of program listings and time, that's how i program. if there is a problem and you feel that i am unfit here, i will gladly leave if you want me too. i hope this clears up the matter. i do not say this to flame anyone, but out of tiredness and genuine anxiety.. i have been kicked from many sites for responding to things like this. in the interest of both myself and those on this site, i ask that you consider if its worth it, to question my skill as a programmer. i am not a serious programmer, nor do i wish to be. i am casual, and if that is viewed with disdain, than view it with disdain, it is of no concern to me. for the sake of my emotional health, refrain from further nitpicking, as i do not want to be banned...again. :(

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby charles » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:22 am

problem solving is what these machines are know best for .! ; )
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby charles » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:22 am

and trivialy entertainment!
The radioactive half-life : )
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby wongck » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:30 am

MrPixel wrote:i am of the camp that still uses basic and relishes the glory days of coding. when you didn't have to go to class to learn how to program. a computer, a book of program listings and time, that's how i program. if there is a problem and you feel that i am unfit here, i will gladly leave if you want me too. i hope this clears up the matter. i do not say this to flame anyone, but out of tiredness and genuine anxiety. please refrain from further questioning of my programming skill, please


No problem with how you want to code and no problem with you asking for help as well.
I will try to help, after all this Atari community needs users to contribute and help each other.

And that advise here and in the other threads about young coders, is the advise that seems logical for you to do.
Certain computing topics like syntax, what each keyword does and program flow control etc etc may be quicker to understand if someone tells you but then we cannot be telling you all these in a forum thread.... so the next best would be to read about it. It's probably better explained there. Your choice on the approach to take.

I would say you have been very daring to even post such a code fragment. At least you posted something, rather just asking for more code examples. People may ridicule at your code, but without those people pointing them out, would you have known the mistakes? Do you know what's wrong with it? And how to fix the code? Learn from it. People here question your programming skills, sure they do, take it as learning and improve from it. Use that negative energy and put it to better use.

charles wrote:atari is my lifestyle,not a hobby.
HOLD ON ! ! !,
Im printing unreadable characters ...!


And not to mention how Charles have survive all these years with all the criticism about his programming.
Seems like Charles doing great, enjoying every moment as well. :wink:
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby thomas3 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:27 am

Well, this thread has actually been pretty inspirational for me, at least. It has led me to complete the Turing test successfully - in basic!!!

Here's the listing for you guys to try yourselves:

10 print "What shall we talk about?"
20 input a$
30 print "Oh, sorry. I didn't realise you were too busy to talk. How about later instead?"
40 input a$
50 print "Great! A discussion on postmodern philosophy at 3.15pm tomorrow it is! Speak then."
60 goto 65
65 cls : end

The performance of my AI algorithm here is spooky, as you'll see.

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby wongck » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:47 am

doesn't work
Syntax error
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby thomas3 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:06 pm

wongck wrote:doesn't work
Syntax error


Really?

Ok, maybe just check if your computer is switched on at the plug?

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby simonsunnyboy » Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:09 pm

thomas3 wrote:Well, this thread has actually been pretty inspirational for me, at least. It has led me to complete the Turing test successfully - in basic!!!

Here's the listing for you guys to try yourselves:

10 print "What shall we talk about?"
20 input a$
30 print "Oh, sorry. I didn't realise you were too busy to talk. How about later instead?"
40 input a$
50 print "Great! A discussion on postmodern philosophy at 3.15pm tomorrow it is! Speak then."
60 goto 65
65 cls : end

The performance of my AI algorithm here is spooky, as you'll see.


Except for the CLS it will work anywhere and I think you are right. Most ELiza tools will probbaly look a lot like that, with a small thing thrown in to reuse typed text pieces in the replies.

You made me smile for the first time today :mrgreen:
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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:12 pm

wongck wrote:
MrPixel wrote:i am of the camp that still uses basic and relishes the glory days of coding. when you didn't have to go to class to learn how to program. a computer, a book of program listings and time, that's how i program. if there is a problem and you feel that i am unfit here, i will gladly leave if you want me too. i hope this clears up the matter. i do not say this to flame anyone, but out of tiredness and genuine anxiety. please refrain from further questioning of my programming skill, please


No problem with how you want to code and no problem with you asking for help as well.
I will try to help, after all this Atari community needs users to contribute and help each other.

And that advise here and in the other threads about young coders, is the advise that seems logical for you to do.
Certain computing topics like syntax, what each keyword does and program flow control etc etc may be quicker to understand if someone tells you but then we cannot be telling you all these in a forum thread.... so the next best would be to read about it. It's probably better explained there. Your choice on the approach to take.

I would say you have been very daring to even post such a code fragment. At least you posted something, rather just asking for more code examples. People may ridicule at your code, but without those people pointing them out, would you have known the mistakes? Do you know what's wrong with it? And how to fix the code? Learn from it. People here question your programming skills, sure they do, take it as learning and improve from it. Use that negative energy and put it to better use.

thanks for that. on that topic, what is the syntax for the input command? i always think it was something like this

input "what is your choice";c

of course i want the player to chose from a,b,c or d but all i can ever do are numbers

like so:

if A<10 then goto 45

i don't want the player to choose a number

any ideas? currently programming on the commodore line of computers and an atari 800 at school (any idea where i can find a cheap tape drive?)\\

also, the editor assembler, i tried to print out the machine code program from the december 1985 issue of compute, but kept getting errors. MLX is crap, any ideas?

sorry, for the long post :cheers:

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:17 pm

MrPixel wrote:
wongck wrote:
MrPixel wrote:i am of the camp that still uses basic and relishes the glory days of coding. when you didn't have to go to class to learn how to program. a computer, a book of program listings and time, that's how i program. if there is a problem and you feel that i am unfit here, i will gladly leave if you want me too. i hope this clears up the matter. i do not say this to flame anyone, but out of tiredness and genuine anxiety. please refrain from further questioning of my programming skill, please



thanks for that. on that topic, what is the syntax for the input command? i always think it was something like this

input "what is your choice";c

of course i want the player to chose from a,b,c or d but all i can ever do are numbers

like so:

if A<10 then goto 45

i don't want the player to choose a number

any ideas? currently programming on the commodore line of computers and an atari 800 at school (any idea where i can find a cheap tape drive?)\\

also, the editor assembler, i tried to print out the machine code program from the december 1985 issue of compute, but kept getting errors. MLX is crap, any ideas?

sorry, for the long post :cheers:

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:18 pm

great, i meant to quote you but now the whole thing is selected, just one of those days

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby Foxie » Fri Mar 09, 2018 7:44 pm

How many professional / high end projects were written in BASIC? I think the number might be higher than a lot of people think! BBC BASIC in particular was widely seen as a credible professional tool. Of course there's also Visual BASIC which was widely used, but I'm not that interested in IBM compatible crap.

AFAIK, large parts of RISC OS were written in BBC BASIC. I've also seen BBC BASIC being used in industrial applications, particularly the IBM port of BBC BASIC. It has the advantage of being extremely approachable for someone without a computer science background. Using peek and poke, you can do some pretty serious automation tasks with it.

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:43 pm

i'm looking for the disk version of MLX. are there any mirrors with it for download? preferably c64 or apple II

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby thomas3 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 9:13 pm

MrPixel wrote:thanks for that. on that topic, what is the syntax for the input command? i always think it was something like this

input "what is your choice";c

of course i want the player to chose from a,b,c or d but all i can ever do are numbers

like so:

if A<10 then goto 45

i don't want the player to choose a number

any ideas?


There's two ways you can do this.

If you check the DHS source archive, you can find a neat trick that lets you do it in three scanlines plus one sync line.

Alternatively, you could follow Foxie's suggestion and try this:

10 repeat
20 poke rnd($ffffffff), 255
30 until false

It might take a while and a few runs, but eventually that programme will produce the results you're hoping for.

Hope that helps! :cheers:

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:26 pm

is this for apple? or commodore 64?

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:48 pm

32k plus views. if i had this many on my youtube channel, we'd be in vegas

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby charles » Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:15 pm

I have the turing object orieenteed language text book here if somebody has the Atari version of the language ,,its developed about 75 miles from me at the university of waterloo and university of Toronto

very much pascal/modula like ...

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby thomas3 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:33 pm

MrPixel wrote:is this for apple? or commodore 64?


It works best on the Apple 64.

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Re: Noobs use C, real programmers use Basic

Postby MrPixel » Sat Mar 10, 2018 12:11 am

so, just found supermon 64 and am currently trying to enter the ML program for balloon crazy. i don't know how kids did this without boredom. anyway, i start as thus:

a2000

then i begin printing the code (compute magazine issue 67 page 52) but all i get are a string of numbers. is something wrong with my code?


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