Amstrad CPC Discussion (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

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Amstrad CPC Discussion (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby joska » Thu Feb 08, 2018 11:57 am

simonsunnyboy wrote: if CPC users can brag about one thing, it's their BASIC interpreter ;)


The CPC - and especially the 6128 - is one of the best 8-bit machines. Low price, good performance, built-in floppydrive, 80-column screen, easily expandable, cp/m and some really good games. Locomotive BASIC is rather good too, although the editor is horrible compared to the fullscreen editor found in other BASICs.
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Re: Graphics in Locomotive basic

Postby Gryzor » Thu Feb 08, 2018 12:11 pm

Granted, I've not used others extensively, but what's wrong about the CPC's editor?
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Re: Graphics in Locomotive basic

Postby joska » Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:14 pm

Gryzor wrote:Granted, I've not used others extensively, but what's wrong about the CPC's editor?


It's a line-editor. I guess this is fine if you're used to it, but when you're used to a fullscreen editor it's quite awful. Most 8-bits had better BASIC editors than the CPC.
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Re: Graphics in Locomotive basic

Postby Gryzor » Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:18 pm

Well, true, in the sense that you have to press COPY when you reach the line that interests you. Is this so bad?

A follow-up question: any 8-bitter that had a scrolling editor?
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Re: Graphics in Locomotive basic

Postby joska » Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:45 pm

Gryzor wrote:Well, true, in the sense that you have to press COPY when you reach the line that interests you. Is this so bad?


Compared to just edit the line directly - yes. Editing on e.g. Microsoft Basic on the MSX is *much* more comfortable.

The CPC should be the ideal 8-bit machine to program in BASIC on. Good BASIC, 80-column screen, floppy, 128Kb RAM, low price... However, they made a big mistake with the poor editor and the lack of support for RAM above 64Kb in BASIC.

Gryzor wrote:A follow-up question: any 8-bitter that had a scrolling editor?


Yes, the Sharp MZ series. With a fullscreen editor :)
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Re: Graphics in Locomotive basic

Postby Gryzor » Thu Feb 08, 2018 1:51 pm

Never used a Sharp MZ (lovely machines!) except to run an emulated program or two, got to check it out (though, if I'm not mistaken the MZ series run up to the late 80s with new models, so it wouldn't surprise me...).

Didn't remember the thing about the MSX despite having used them - I guess I'm too accustomed to the CPC :D

But hey, calling the editor 'poor' is, I think, taking it a bit too far. I mean, if nothing else and just off the top of my head, I'd take an 80-column editor over one that doesn't need pressing 'copy' ;)
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Re: Graphics in Locomotive basic

Postby joska » Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:08 pm

The MZ had a scrolling editor from the beginning (late 70's). But yes - 80 column is a huge advantage for the CPC compared to most 8-bits. Together with the built-in diskdrive this is one of it's strongest points. But the editor *is* poor, something that was commented on in reviews when the CPC arrived. Consensus was that the editor was a big disappointment for a machine that was launched at the end of the 8-bit era. The Copy key is a workaround to make the line-editor slightly more usable, but line-editors was a thing of the past even in 1984 when the CPC was launched.
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Re: Graphics in Locomotive basic

Postby simonsunnyboy » Thu Feb 08, 2018 4:14 pm

joska wrote:
simonsunnyboy wrote: if CPC users can brag about one thing, it's their BASIC interpreter ;)


The CPC - and especially the 6128 - is one of the best 8-bit machines. Low price, good performance, built-in floppydrive, 80-column screen, easily expandable, cp/m and some really good games. Locomotive BASIC is rather good too, although the editor is horrible compared to the fullscreen editor found in other BASICs.


I fully agree, the editor is still ages ahead of other 8Bits. The copy cursor is quite neat.

But most people don't seem to get the point of the 80 columns or the CP/M compatibility.

Someday i have to add a 6128 with HxC to my collection. Already have Spectrum +2A from the Z80 camp...
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Re: Amstrad CPC Advocacy (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby Mug UK » Thu Feb 08, 2018 7:04 pm

It's nowhere near as bad as the cobbled together BASIC editor that Amstrad dumped into the +2a/+2b/+3 machines. That 'EDIT' button just gets in the way of anyone who's ever used a proper keyboard beforehand.
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Re: Amstrad CPC Advocacy (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby MrPixel » Sat Feb 10, 2018 12:52 am

why make a sub thread in one that i started? doesn't make sense

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Re: Amstrad CPC Advocacy (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby simonsunnyboy » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:55 am

Because this drifted into CPC advocacy and has no content on Locomotive Basic graphical features anymore. The graphics command discussion belongs in the old thread, generic CPC good or bad here.
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Re: Amstrad CPC Advocacy (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby Gryzor » Sat Feb 10, 2018 9:57 am

I do see the point, but the new subject is misleading and prone to lead to a flame or something; nobody was advocating anything for or against, we were just discussing the pros and cons in a very nice way.
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Re: Amstrad CPC Advocacy (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby MrPixel » Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:35 pm

exactly. don't see how CPC advocacy applies to my old thread but what the hell

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Re: Amstrad CPC Advocacy (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby simonsunnyboy » Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:28 am

Some feel free to rename, discussing Pros and Cons contains advocacy so i don't see the problem.
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Re: Amstrad CPC Advocacy (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby Gryzor » Sun Feb 11, 2018 10:41 am

Really? Discussion=advocacy?
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Re: Amstrad CPC Discussion (was: Graphics in Locomotive basic)

Postby MrPixel » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:05 pm

i did some programming on the CPC and i do have one thing to say: Whoever ported NARC, needs to be fired


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