Hatari on tablet device

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby squall » Tue Jan 28, 2014 10:45 am

Thanks for the feedback JLsoft. It wouldn't of been possible without the original authors of Hatari who made such an excellent open source emulator and the awesome keyboard art from Greyfox/unseenmenace.

I'm glad it worked well for you. I haven't gotten round to looking at supporting hardware keyboard and joysticks yet, so it's great to hear that it you can use an alternative for now.

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby troed » Tue Jan 28, 2014 10:58 am

I'm amazed as to how well the UI worked. Much appreciated!

And yes, Sony Xperia owners are likely interested in being able to use connected PS3 dualshock controllers as gamepads ;)

http://developer.sonymobile.com/2013/10 ... ame-video/

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby Champions_2002 » Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:12 pm

This is a great bit of software.


i have it up and running but how do i load a game in i can only use the mouse and joystick with the desktop where is the button to get the filebrowser

and how do i add a hard drive file

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby squall » Tue Jan 28, 2014 9:33 pm

@troed
- thanks for the link! Looks helpful for when I do the joystick stuff.

@Champions_2002
- you click on the system menu button to bring up the action bar with the disc buttons and settings dialog where you can change the hard disk.
- on versions before honeycomb, you should have a physical menu button on your phone/tablet. On newer versions of android, there should be a button with 3 dots on your system bar (should be next to the home/task buttons).
Which version of android are you running?

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:17 am

Champions_2002 wrote:This is a great bit of software.


i have it up and running but how do i load a game in i can only use the mouse and joystick with the desktop where is the button to get the filebrowser

and how do i add a hard drive file

Champions_2002


Depends on your device, here's how to access it on both on my Archos Gamepad tablet and on my Samsung Galaxy S3 (obviously when the app is running).
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:25 am

troed wrote:I'm amazed as to how well the UI worked. Much appreciated!

And yes, Sony Xperia owners are likely interested in being able to use connected PS3 dualshock controllers as gamepads ;)

http://developer.sonymobile.com/2013/10 ... ame-video/


You can do this with any Android device that has bluetooth, just use the SixAxis app (there's a free compatibility checker you can download first to make sure it'll work with your device).
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Atari STE Tos 1.62 | 4mb | HxC Slim SD 8GB
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby Champions_2002 » Wed Jan 29, 2014 8:20 am

Ha i did not know what that button was for, i have got it working.

I have just played Bumpy's Arcade Game and i think the Emulator is great, it's like finding Pacifist for the first time back in 95-95 and seeing what game will work on it.

Will there be a falcon edition like Hatari for windows
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby squall » Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:03 am

@Champions_2002
- Yeah, a falcon version wouldn't be too much work. It's in my todo list which you can see in the help screen. :P Not sure how fast it'll run though (definitely won't be full speed on my old tablet).

Sorry haven't had much time to work on Hataroid this week. Will try to get some of the recent ui requests done this weekend.

My current (flexible) priority list is to do any small requests and bugs that come up, save states, built-in emutos, midi support (if possible), ui improvements and then hardware joystick and keyboard support.

I'm also in the process of upgrading Hataroid to work with the newest android sdk (so I can implement immersive mode on Kit Kat), but I'm doing that as an ongoing thing in a separate branch as a few things are broken (like no more legacy menu buttons on Kit Kat).

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:08 am

squall wrote:@Champions_2002
- Yeah, a falcon version wouldn't be too much work. It's in my todo list which you can see in the help screen. :P Not sure how fast it'll run though (definitely won't be full speed on my old tablet).

Sorry haven't had much time to work on Hataroid this week. Will try to get some of the recent ui requests done this weekend.

My current (flexible) priority list is to do any small requests and bugs that come up, save states, built-in emutos, midi support (if possible), ui improvements and then hardware joystick and keyboard support.

I'm also in the process of upgrading Hataroid to work with the newest android sdk (so I can implement immersive mode on Kit Kat), but I'm doing that as an ongoing thing in a separate branch as a few things are broken (like no more legacy menu buttons on Kit Kat).


Keep up the good work and +1 for .STX pasti support.
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Wed Jan 29, 2014 7:56 pm

Another improvement would be the ability to somehow save custom sets of useful keys to the display, would be particularly useful for games like Obsession where you use solely the keyboard and not the mouse or joystick.
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby Eero Tamminen » Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:27 pm

squall wrote:Yeah, a falcon version wouldn't be too much work. It's in my todo list which you can see in the help screen. :P Not sure how fast it'll run though (definitely won't be full speed on my old tablet).


DSP emulation is too heavy for a tablet, rest of Falcon emulation is peanuts [1]. I recommend disabling DSP and using old UAE CPU core (instead of WinUAE one recommended for Falcon) as without DSP that works as well and is a bit more lightweight. Hatari compatiblity list tells which Falcon games, demos and programs work with DSP emulation set to "none" or "dummy" one (Hatari enables DSP emulation for Falcon by default):
http://hg.tuxfamily.org/mercurialroot/h ... ility_list

[1] e.g. VIDEL emulation takes more CPU, but only a little. What you run under emulation is more important for performance.

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby squall » Thu Jan 30, 2014 11:53 am

@catmando - Yep, I definitely want that feature myself :P I want to be able to place down keys/buttons where I want on the screen and let the user assign them to whatever key/button they want. It's a bigger task so I haven't started it yet, but for now I'm thinking of putting in an "obsession" mode which just has the keys necessary for it :)

@Eero Tamminen - Thanks for the tips, I'll try it with the old uae core first and dsp disabled and see how compatible it is.

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Thu Jan 30, 2014 12:21 pm

squall wrote:@catmando - Yep, I definitely want that feature myself :P I want to be able to place down keys/buttons where I want on the screen and let the user assign them to whatever key/button they want. It's a bigger task so I haven't started it yet, but for now I'm thinking of putting in an "obsession" mode which just has the keys necessary for it :)


One of the best usability features of Hataroid is that you've already recognised some of the most useful keys used to navigate the cracked menus, surprised I've not seen this on any other Amiga, spectrum of C64 emulator. This is what makes Hataroid a pleasure to use.
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Sat Feb 01, 2014 6:56 pm

I've been having problems getting this Lotus III Cynix crack to work, SToid hangs at the code screen and Hataroid crashes just before the gameplay begins. Maybe it's a dodgy rom?
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby Greyfox™ » Sat Feb 01, 2014 8:57 pm

I'm having issues myself regarding medium resolution appears to be a scan lined format with breaks, meaning the scanlines are uniform then a gap, any chance of these being removed from medium res? Or high res?, I know its because of downscaling it to conform to the screen but sorta ruins the experience will playing Bolo (arknoid clone)

Also "Stampede" (Disc Magazine) commercial does not work from issue 1 to 7 under all tos files 1.04, 1.62, 2.06 and EMUTos, these releases are from the Atari ST tosec collection (April 2012), the issue I think is its leaping from initial low res to medium res, Hataroid is then throwing up a CPU error, any ideas? No matter what way it's launched . Simply incompatible perhaps?

Also looking to the new features you have planned :)
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby squall » Sat Feb 01, 2014 11:17 pm

@catmando
- That version of Lotus III is a bad dump. I just tried it out on real ST hardware and it crashes to a black screen after the title (it was a pain to setup my atari st again, but was worth it :P). It also behaves the same way on both Hatari and Hataroid.

@Greyfox
- Oh, I remember bolo! Yeah hopefully I will have some resolution presets in the next version (eg 1x, 2x, 3x) which will fix these aliasing issues (but may not fit on everyone's screen fully (either more black borders, or getting cut off, - there's no way around this if we want integer scaling factors)

- If Hataroid throws a CPU error, it will do the same thing in Hatari as well. Can you send me an example of one of these discs so I can confirm. If it doesn't work in Hatari using the same settings either, then it's something that's better for the Hatari authors to look at.

@ New version pushed to store (may take a couple of hours to come through)
- mainly requests:
- pause/unpause emulation
- screen zoom presets toggle (fit, x1, x2, x3, x4, stretch full)
- keyboard zoom presets toggle (fit, x1, x2)
- remember last tos folder used (separately from disc images folder)
- option for additional keys in on-screen keyboard (for gem applications)
- on-screen keyboard option suitable for 'obsession'
- option to hide all on-screen buttons
- option to only show on-screen joystick controls

@regards to compatibility:
I haven't modified any of the core Hatari source so theoretically everything that works in Hatari 1.70 with the same settings will work on Hataroid. If you find any discs where this is not the case, please let me know.

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Sun Feb 02, 2014 3:08 pm

Loving the obsession mode. Well done. Can you make the key responses any quicker or maybe its just my device? :-)

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Atari Falcon Tos 4.04 | 14mb | IDE CF 2GB
Atari STE Tos 1.62 | 4mb | HxC Slim SD 8GB
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby squall » Sun Feb 02, 2014 9:26 pm

@catmando
What are the specs of your device?
Just as a test, can you disable the sound option in the settings and see if it helps? I'm thinking it might be the audio lag making it feel worse.

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:31 am

squall wrote:@catmando
What are the specs of your device?
Just as a test, can you disable the sound option in the settings and see if it helps? I'm thinking it might be the audio lag making it feel worse.


I am using an Archos Gamepad http://www.archos.com/gb/products/themed/gamepad/index.html

    Tech Specs

    Display
    • 7’’: 1024x600 capacitive 5 points multitouch screen

    Application Framework
    • Android 4.1 Jelly Bean

    Processor
    • ARM CORTEX™ dual-core A9 @ 1.6GHz
    • GPU quad-core Mali 400 MP
    • 3D OpenGL (ES 2.0)
    Capacity
    • Flash Memory: 8GB* + microSD Slot (SDHC compatible up to 64GB)

    RAM
    • 1GB RAM

    Video playback1 • H.264 HD (up to 1080p@30 fps)
    • MPEG-42 HD (up to 1080p@30 fps)
    • With the above codecs, the device can play video files with the following extensions: AVI, MP4, MOV, 3GP, MPG, PS, TS, MKV, FLV

    Audio Playback1 • MP3
    • WAV (PCM/ADPCM)
    • AAC3, AAC+ 5.13
    • OGG Vorbis
    • FLAC


I also have a Samsung Galaxy S3 that I could test it on, will give your suggestion a try later today.
Atari Falcon Tos 4.04 | 14mb | IDE CF 2GB
Atari STE Tos 1.62 | 4mb | HxC Slim SD 8GB
Atari STE Tos 1.62/2.06 | 4mb | Floppy A-B Mod | IDE SD 4GB
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby troed » Mon Feb 03, 2014 8:12 am

catmando wrote:Can you make the key responses any quicker or maybe its just my device? :-)


That's one area where newer versions of Android should make a noticeable difference.

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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby Indus » Mon Feb 03, 2014 9:55 pm

I just found a small bug. In the "Display" setting, when I check the "Full Screen" option, the image ratio is changed from 4:3 to 16:9 and the image is streched and when I uncheck after the "Full Screen" option, the image ratio is not changed and stay at 16:9 and streched.

About the keyboard, is there any way to have an other keyboard like the french one (AZERTY) ? If not, you should implement all the foreign ST keyboards :wink:

Also, a tool to launch the emulator with different games and configurations (like "DosBox Manager" for "DosBox Turbo") will be welcome.

If you need help, I can test Hataroid on a "Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 7", a "Samsung Galaxy SII" and an "Archos Gamepad 2"
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby Mug UK » Mon Feb 03, 2014 10:49 pm

Greyfox™ wrote:Also "Stampede" (Disc Magazine) commercial does not work from issue 1 to 7 under all tos files 1.04, 1.62, 2.06 and EMUTos, these releases are from the Atari ST tosec collection (April 2012), the issue I think is its leaping from initial low res to medium res, Hataroid is then throwing up a CPU error, any ideas? No matter what way it's launched . Simply incompatible perhaps?


Weren't these Rob Northern protected disk mags?
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby Greyfox™ » Mon Feb 03, 2014 11:49 pm

Yeah..rob northern does it again, with the new Hataroid update, they don't crash, just a black screen now, they came out in 1990, so the Atari STe is not compatible, so it must be some sort of protection that's stopping Hataroid?

But loving the new features, x3 scaling is great..this really is an amazing piece of kit..puts SToid to absolute shame.
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby catmando » Tue Feb 04, 2014 6:20 am

squall wrote:@catmando
What are the specs of your device?
Just as a test, can you disable the sound option in the settings and see if it helps? I'm thinking it might be the audio lag making it feel worse.


Okay I've tested Obsession on Archos Gamepad and Samsung Galaxy S3 with the sound settings ON and OFF. My findings are as follows:

1. On both devices my scores do appear slightly better when the sound is OFF. Though I still feel the responsiveness is still slightly slow and not that much improved from when the sound is ON. (There's no lag in framerate or slowdown on either device btw). A good test you can try is by catching the ball with one of the flippers (so it is caught in the 'V'). Once it is stationary release the flipper so it rolls down the flipper and try to flick the ball, from playing it on the ST it should be quite easy to flick the ball halfway along the flipper and not just when it reaches the end of the flipper. Hope that makes sense.
2. The difference in screen touch technology between the Archos gamepad and Samsung Galaxy S3 does make a difference. The S3 feels more responsive.


With regard to the obsession controls, can I suggest the following improvements:

1. Swap the positions of the nudge and plunger buttons (think it makes more sense to have the plunger button on the same side as the plunger on the screen)
2. For the nudge button could you take advantage of the accelerometer, so that you bump the device to initiate a nudge?

Cheers
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Re: Hatari on tablet device

Postby squall » Tue Feb 04, 2014 10:43 am

@Indus
- Thanks for helping test. I'll fix the bug in the next release.
- Other keyboards are definitely possible.
- A library of games and configurations is also a good idea. I remember WinSTon used to have something like that I think.
I'll put these on the todo list.

@catmando
- I'll try to see what else I can do with the input lag, but it's already doing: touch input events -> emulation frame -> render, so there might not be much room to move.
- I'll update the controls to your suggestions. The accelerometer will be a bit more work. so I'll have to add that to the todo list.


I'm also thinking of starting support for external controllers this weekend. I've done a little bit of reading and it seems like using an Input Method seems like the best way that works across all versions without rooting. Since I don't have any hardware, I'll be coding blind, so I wanted to get info from people who use external controllers:

- Is your external controller supported as an Input Method? If not, what method do you use to get it to work with other android apps?
- If I write a small test app, could you guys run it and take a screenshot of the outputted values (so I can have a drop down box of presets, eg archos pad, xperia, wiimote, etc) (or even better, if you already know what the keycode values are for each of the buttons, that would be best).

Thanks,


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