DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

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frost
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Postby frost » Tue Jan 15, 2008 9:45 am

panos wrote:It works on falcons with TOS 4.04 but it doesn't seem to work with TOS 4.01....Is there any difference? Can anybody tell?


This key combination has been introduced with TOS 4.03.
From TOS 4.00 to TOS 4.02, you need to boot up with a monochrome monitor and run a config tool to reset the NVRAM.
(according to this doc, in french sorry)

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Postby panos » Tue Jan 15, 2008 11:17 am

Thanks a lot!
But, where can I find this "config" tool?
How is the name of the file?
*CX-2600
*520 STFM (1MB RAM)+SM124
*520 STE (4MB RAM)+SC1224
*MegaSTE(4MB RAM/270MB HD)+SM124
*TT030 (4MB RAM/8MB FaST RAM)
*Falcon030(4MB ST-10MBFasTT/2GB CF/FX3in1)+SC1435
*Falcon030(14MB/2GB CF/SCSI CDRW)
*C-LAB Falcon MK-II(14mb RAM,500mb sCSI)
*C-LAB Falcon MK-X(4MB/3GB HD/SCSI CD-R)
*Jaguar+JagCD

/|\ STAY ATARI /|\

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Postby frost » Tue Jan 15, 2008 3:02 pm

Use Bootconf from Uwe Seimet or NVRAM from Centek. They do the same.

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Postby panos » Wed Jan 16, 2008 9:06 am

I booted the Falcon with the SM124 and used BOOTCONF. Everything worked fine. My TOS version is 4.02.

Many thanks :D
*CX-2600
*520 STFM (1MB RAM)+SM124
*520 STE (4MB RAM)+SC1224
*MegaSTE(4MB RAM/270MB HD)+SM124
*TT030 (4MB RAM/8MB FaST RAM)
*Falcon030(4MB ST-10MBFasTT/2GB CF/FX3in1)+SC1435
*Falcon030(14MB/2GB CF/SCSI CDRW)
*C-LAB Falcon MK-II(14mb RAM,500mb sCSI)
*C-LAB Falcon MK-X(4MB/3GB HD/SCSI CD-R)
*Jaguar+JagCD

/|\ STAY ATARI /|\

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Postby frost » Wed Jan 16, 2008 12:24 pm

Excellent ! :D

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Fri Mar 21, 2008 6:49 pm

A short while ago, I got myself a Dallas / Maxim Chip... Yes the free example on,e and I got 2 also.

On my Falcon however, I have a CT63 and when I try setting the info in the NVRAM it says unknown flash device, and it only saves half the info... It does however save the half properly.

Now, recently I decided to finally sort out the issues in my CT63 / Falcon and its now seemingly fully working, however, now, what is happening is that the NVRAM is no longer storing ANY information at all and after it has been turned off for any length of time, it has forgotten everything.

The Chip I am using is the 12887A and it was working in that 50-50 mode and now all of a sudden, its completely dead... Surely if it was its battery, then it would go over time and not instantly? Its also done this on the second Chip might I add... This was dead the next day

Anyway, has anyone got anything that might help me out?
MSTE @ 16Mhz : 4MB+8MB : Magic & Jinnee
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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby rian_ata » Wed May 21, 2008 8:54 pm

FatRakoon wrote:The Chip I am using is the 12887A and it was working in that 50-50 mode and now all of a sudden, its completely dead... Surely if it was its battery, then it would go over time and not instantly? Its also done this on the second Chip might I add... This was dead the next day

Anyway, has anyone got anything that might help me out?


My replacement Dallas chip is a DS1287 and is working 100% for 6 months now. A few weeks ago I received two DS12887 chips from Dallas. It seems the DS1287 isn't available anymore.

From somewhere on the internet I found the following informationabout the differences between the chips:

"What is the difference between the DS12887 and DS12887A? What is RAM clear?
The "A" at the end of the part number indicates a "RAM clear" pin. This is true for many clock modules, including
those from other manufacturers. The DS12B887 also has a RAM clear function; however, it works differently
than the "A" RAM clear. RAM clear is a way to reset the user RAM in the clock module. The user RAM is normally used to hold the CMOS setup information. If a BIOS has a BIOS (boot) password option (not to be confused with the Windows password), the password can usually be reset by clearing the CMOS setup (user RAM). Usually, a part without the RAM clear option will replace a part that does have one. However, if a BIOS password is used and then forgotten, there is no way to reset it. The clock module would need to be replaced."


Another interesting document about these chips has been attached.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Wed May 21, 2008 9:40 pm

I dont think that the Atari needs to be concerned about these minor differences???

I could be wrong, but, I am told that the Atari does not even have that pin... Never bothered to check that out to be honest, I just assumed that I was told the facts and took it as read.
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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby Mark_G » Sun Jun 29, 2008 11:13 am

Hello,

A while ago I let replace the nvram chips. I asked for a socket solution.

However the guy told me that the chip+socket would touch the shield, and he said that it was not possible to use the socket.
So he soldered a new chip inside; 5it was very well done however, and I'm happy with the mod.).

Some of you has placed a socket together with the chip. Do you replaced the the shield also ? DO it touch the shield ?

Mark.

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby puppetmark » Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:31 pm

I cut a space out of the shield so I could use a socket. I used the lowest profile socket I could find and it still touched the shield a bit. I used a sheet metal nibbling tool to notch out the opening.

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby Desty » Thu Aug 07, 2008 3:42 pm

Can you not just insulate the part of the socket that touches the shield, or is this silly? :P
I've been meaning to replace the battery on my Falcon/CT2 ever since I picked it up like... 6 months ago or something.
tá'n poc ar buile!

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby puppetmark » Thu Aug 07, 2008 7:22 pm

I tried that but I could not get the shield to fit flat onto the motherboard so I cut the shield.

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby Desty » Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:51 pm

Damn :x I'll have to get clever then. No mean feat....
tá'n poc ar buile!

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Mon Dec 29, 2008 11:17 pm

Ok when I had the socket done for my Clock chip, the guy missed out on PIN 5

the pin itself was kind of stuck out and so, I attached it by way of a small wire that went underneath to the solder point.

Did this help? - Id like to hope it did, but the date didnt do!

Anyway, today, I decided to tackle this myself and clean up the disgusting mess that the git did to my Falcon and I have just this minute finished ( Not tested it yet - I need a break first )

Ok, pin 5 is an address pin so there is a very strong chance that needs to be done, but also I found out that pin 20 might also have been shafty too?

I dont know what the guy has done, but I could not get the hole for pin 20 opened at all? - its as if the original pin was never there in the first place???

The Data sheet says that this pin 20 ( The one closest to the MOUSE ports at the front ) is GROUND!

Anyway, the only way I have been able to attach it, is once again, to break the pin 20 ( Luckily the socket I have used this time is on pinsso it left a gap to allow me to tack the leg off pin 20 onto a blob of solder on the Mobo... I am really annoyed at this because I have taken a long time and all teh other 39 pins have such a precise and perfect join now that it looks like its been done on a machine ( Apart from the burn marks the other tit did of course )

Is pin 20 ( Ground ) used on the Falcon? - it must do surely, its the only ground on it, but what if its an iffy join, can the chip work partially?

All other pins except 5 and 20 seemed to be ok?

Can anyone tell me... Just in case Pin 20 hole is not going all teh way through... What side of the Falcons board is pin 20 attached to? - I a mthinking that I might need to trace a wire around to the bottom of the board after all???? - at least this time it will be a ground I suppose?

Thanks.
MSTE @ 16Mhz : 4MB+8MB : Magic & Jinnee
TT030 @ 32Mhz : 10+16MB : Magic & Jinnee
Falcon060 @ 95Mhz : 16+512MB : MiNT & Jinnee
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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby karlm » Tue Dec 30, 2008 1:41 am

Frk - you must have been reading my mind, I finally got around to doing exactly the same thing the other night. Sounds like the guy might have clipped the legs off the old chip when removing it, and the old leg is still stuck in it (pin 20.) Without the ground, the rest of the chip will most likely not work (if it hasn't been cooked by the clod who did it before!) You may have to get the leg of a resistor or the like and apply some light pressure to the solder on one side whislt heating it up (the solder blob) to shove the bit of leg through.

I socketed mine too, and at the moment the machine is together without the shielding. I'm thinking whilst I've got it all pulled down I will socket the floppy cable too - be neat to have two drives running off my Falcon.

The only other hint I have is to use desoldering wick - it's been years since I did any electronics, and using one of those solder pumps was a waste of time ... bring on the wick!

cheers

karlm.

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Tue Dec 30, 2008 1:54 am

Yes, definitely use solder braid... Wick its also known as yes.

Pin stuck.

Well, yes, I was using a diode to knock the holes through properly, but its like as if there was never a hole there... Its really THAT bad of a job...
I cannot work out if the old pin or solder or whatever is going through to the other side, it really is such a bad job. I seriously doubt that it was not there at all because the thing seemed like it was ok... So... Must have been on / through?

DATE testing can take a while so Im keeping a check on it now ( Thats why I decided to take it on again ) and every time I do something it gets one step closer to being fully sorted... I am even taking a closer look at MiNT again... Not something that I really enjoy, being a Magic fan.

Oh, just after I re-done the Dallas clock just now, I went into the CT060 CPX module and had a play with the settings...

I saved it to both the Falcons NVRAM and to the CT63 itself and today was the first time that it has ever saved to both.

It still moaned that it did not know the flash type mind you, but thats neither here not there, its always done that.
The CTPCI-404 archive is supposed to cure it but it does not.
MSTE @ 16Mhz : 4MB+8MB : Magic & Jinnee
TT030 @ 32Mhz : 10+16MB : Magic & Jinnee
Falcon060 @ 95Mhz : 16+512MB : MiNT & Jinnee
More PCs than PC World has... Probably

ppera

Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby ppera » Sun Jan 04, 2009 8:22 pm

Some notices after todays experience:

I replaced battery by original Motorola clock/NVRAM chip. Then clock started to work, and worked fine without Falcon powered on. But I was unable to update NVRAM with German CPX modul ( 'Das Boot' :D ). So, I thought that chip is problem. Digged out Dallas DS1287, added socket and it worked not, of course, as DS1287 is from 1991. So, I replaced battery in it too, what was much harder, as it has battery in hard plastic. Actually, it worked only by cutting plastic with small fraser. Anyway, after it clock worked again, but setting NVRAM not... Damn ! After it, I looked for some other SW for settings.
From linked French site I got NVRAM.APP, and it made the job.
So, 'Das Boot' CPX works not always. Is problem that TOS is 4.02 ?
NVRAM settings affect Falcon's ability to boot without floppy.

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:05 pm

Dallas 1287? - I got the 12887A - Thats the same isnt it? or as close as...

Anyway, I got mine from MAXIM - I was told on an atari forum, very possibly this one that you can order a free test chip from Maxim and they will send one out to you. Like many, I got 2

Cutting things short, I have a spare.
Do you want me to post it to you?

PM me with an address and I will happily get it sent to you
MSTE @ 16Mhz : 4MB+8MB : Magic & Jinnee
TT030 @ 32Mhz : 10+16MB : Magic & Jinnee
Falcon060 @ 95Mhz : 16+512MB : MiNT & Jinnee
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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby ppera » Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:29 pm

FatRakoon wrote:Dallas 1287? - I got the 12887A - Thats the same isnt it? or as close as...

Anyway, I got mine from MAXIM - I was told on an atari forum, very possibly this one that you can order a free test chip from Maxim and they will send one out to you. Like many, I got 2

Cutting things short, I have a spare.
Do you want me to post it to you?

PM me with an address and I will happily get it sent to you



Thanx for offer. But I don't need it really. Maybe it's not clear in my post, but it works now. Problem was NVRAM.CPX SW. Even original Motorola chip is operational. 1287 and A version of it are compatible.
If you insist to send, I will accept :D

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Mon Jan 05, 2009 4:42 pm

ppera wrote:If you insist to send, I will accept :D


The thing is that if you are sorted then it will be a waste of time wont it?
I know that these chips have a life of about 10 years and so, will I even need my spare? - Wont that also be dead by the time the one in there dies?
Or will it be ok to swap out in X years time ?
Decisions decisions...
If it will be of use to someone then Id rather a fellow Atarian get it and make use of it than for it to rot away here
MSTE @ 16Mhz : 4MB+8MB : Magic & Jinnee
TT030 @ 32Mhz : 10+16MB : Magic & Jinnee
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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby bj » Mon Jan 05, 2009 5:16 pm

Hi FatRakoon

I would like to be the happy & appreciative recipient of this spare chip. 8) My falcon started doing strange things not long after I bought it. Wouldn't hold changes in screen resolution then after one change the screen just went blanck. Symptoms of a possible dead battery /chip, I think :( . If you can send it to me PM me & we can make arrangements - postage etc. Ta!
regards
BJ

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby ppera » Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:35 pm

To be precise, we talk about lifetime of battery, not chip. Chip itself should not be frequenter problem, as works at very low power. Of course, for some people replacing battery is not solution. However, it is still simpler in case of Motorola chip than replacing whole chip, as it is not socketed. In case of Dallas chip, it is hard in any case, and you need some equipment as mini fraser to make access to battery pins.

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Tue Jan 06, 2009 3:33 am

bj wrote:Hi FatRakoon
I would like to be the happy & appreciative recipient of this spare chip. 8) My falcon started doing strange things not long after I bought it. Wouldn't hold changes in screen resolution then after one change the screen just went blanck. Symptoms of a possible dead battery /chip, I think :( . If you can send it to me PM me & we can make arrangements - postage etc. Ta!


Only too happy to give back to the Community a small part what I have recently taken from it.

Hang on...

ppera wrote:To be precise, we talk about lifetime of battery, not chip. Chip itself should not be frequenter problem, as works at very low power. Of course, for some people replacing battery is not solution. However, it is still simpler in case of Motorola chip than replacing whole chip, as it is not socketed. In case of Dallas chip, it is hard in any case, and you need some equipment as mini fraser to make access to battery pins.


Nope I lost you after to be precise...
You mening that we can ( If we had a soldering iron perhaps ) do our own "FIX" to the original chip and wire up a couple of wires to a battery ?

Yes, this can be done, and can be done very nicely too, however, if you do it wrong you are in trouble are you not?

I find it rather annoying and yet typically atari to have the battery built-in, but then I suppose to be fair, it does last a fair bit.

I now have mine in a socket and wiile its gone the long way round to do it, the end justifies the means and this is I hope the last battle in a war with me vs my Falcon, and I am now, after all the hate mail i have sent about my Falcon, completely and utterly and firmly in love with her... So much so, that I would not at all be surprised if there was the pitter-patter of tiny little Ataris running round the house soon!

Ah, er... Ahem!

Right, so what I mean is that putting the socket in has made it look nicer. I know its inside etc and looks dont mean anything but its also piece of mind too... If its ugly and you bodge a job, it plays oin your mind, but if you know its a good job, you can sleep soundly at night... I do anyway.
MSTE @ 16Mhz : 4MB+8MB : Magic & Jinnee
TT030 @ 32Mhz : 10+16MB : Magic & Jinnee
Falcon060 @ 95Mhz : 16+512MB : MiNT & Jinnee
More PCs than PC World has... Probably

ppera

Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby ppera » Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:27 pm

FatRakoon wrote:...
I find it rather annoying and yet typically atari to have the battery built-in, but then I suppose to be fair, it does last a fair bit...


It is not typically Atari way. In that time (era of 386, 486 PCs) many PC motherboard had Dallas chip as clock/CMOS RAM. Only that it was socketed in most of cases, so replacing was quite simple (my Dallas was just taken from one 486 MBO, without desoldering :D ) .
Of course, soldering chip with life expectancy of less than 10 years is pretty irresponsible. Or they didn't expect that people will use Falcons so long ?

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Re: DIY: new cell for NVRAM chip

Postby FatRakoon » Tue Jan 06, 2009 1:53 pm

No, I didnt mean just the clock.

I mean that its typical for Atari to just make things awkward for us.

Yes, having a socket would not have cost THAT much more... I mean, what was a 40 pin DIL Socket back then? 8p? 8p on a £500 computer surely wasnt THAT much to ask
MSTE @ 16Mhz : 4MB+8MB : Magic & Jinnee
TT030 @ 32Mhz : 10+16MB : Magic & Jinnee
Falcon060 @ 95Mhz : 16+512MB : MiNT & Jinnee
More PCs than PC World has... Probably


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