Falcon with quiet sound output

Hardware, coding, music, graphic and various applications

Moderators: Mug UK, [ProToS], lp, moondog/.tSCc., Moderator Team

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:01 pm

been working on a newly repaired falcon and all seems well apart from very low volume sound output (even the keyboard click is quiet)

i would say approx 50% of normal level

can anyone suggest why this could be?

headphone socket / internal speaker / TV port and monitor port sound are all quiet

so far: changed the CODEC IC
Last edited by MRAtari on Fri Jul 29, 2011 6:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Dal
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 4161
Joined: Tue Jan 18, 2011 12:31 am
Location: Cheltenham, UK
Contact:

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby Dal » Wed Jul 13, 2011 6:37 pm

Here are the 'standard' Cubase mods

Likely to be the line level audio output mod (number 2)
Mega"SST" 12, MegaSTE, STE: Desktopper case, IDE interface, UltraSatan (8GB + 512Mb) + HXC floppy emulator. Plus some STE's/STFM's

User avatar
BoNuS
Atari Super Hero
Atari Super Hero
Posts: 737
Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2009 12:45 pm
Location: The Netherlands
Contact:

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby BoNuS » Wed Jul 13, 2011 8:27 pm

Thats sounds familiar, I have a falcon with that same problem. The sound is there but ver very far away...
No solution yet, looks like the amplifier is defect ?!
http://bonus.home.xs4all.nl/
2 x Falcon 030 - a mint Atari TT - Mega STE - 2x STE - 1x Mega 2 - 2x STFM - 1 x STF - 3x SC1224 - 2x SM124 - 1x SM125 2x Portofolio+interface
- 3x 1435 monitor - 1 x Ult.Ripper cardridge - Mega 1,2,and 4 ( just to much Atari stuff)

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Wed Jul 13, 2011 9:48 pm

ok

are these U22 / U26 or U29?

i did have to add U22 and U26

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4089
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby nativ » Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:07 pm

Hi,

If you can get hold of an FDI? or such that might be able to tell if it's the anlog subsystem?

Elsewise? is it just with chip sounds or digi too ? and how about dsp based sounds?

cheers
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:37 pm

i have an FDI and can record a CD in cubase audio which i have done

and yes when playing back or recording the sound output is low

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Thu Jul 14, 2011 7:30 pm

ok

so on closer inspection i see the following 2 mods:

standard bass boost mod:

•Change C58 and C59 from 100PF to 1000PF
•Change R123 anr R130 from 10K to 15K
•Change R59 and R68 from 100K to 4.7K
•Change C95 and C90 from 0.033yF to 1K Resistor

microphone input gain mod:


•Remove R56, R57, R90, R92, C21 and C81
•Change R66 and R87 from 100K to 47K. (+) See note below!
•Add a 470pF NPO +/- 5% in parallel with R67
•Add a 470pF NPO +/-5% in parallel with R88
•Add a 100pF NPO +/-5% in parallel with R66
•Add a 100pF NPO +/-5% in parallel with R87
•(+)To achive apx. -10db sensitivity, change R66 and R87 from 100K to 1.8K instead of 47K (this is similar to most hi-fi equipment)




NOW! testing this board with the test cartridge i find that the PSG sound test (same as on STE etc) "listen for low to high sweep" channel A / B / C

this is quiet (about 50% normal volume)

but the DMA sound check on the falcon which tests 4 tones the sound is LOUD! and normal

i'm using a scart cable with a philips cm 8833 monitor and also the headphone socket (same results)

SO could this be the Yamaha chip? or maybe the CODEC or U21 amplifier?

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:38 pm

well it's NOT the codec, just changed it

maybe the Yamaha IC?

User avatar
majere
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 201
Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Spain

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby majere » Wed Aug 03, 2011 11:18 am

I have installed a new internal speaker, and the sound is very low too!
Try the rear headphone jack with external speakers and it's low too :(
ATARI 520ST FM - ATARI MEGA4 - ATARI MEGASTE 4 - 2Xatari TT 30 & Crazy Dots + magnum TT +Netusbee // Falcon + 14mb + SCSI Plextor//Falcon+14mb+CT60+CTPCI+Ethernat

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4089
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby nativ » Wed Aug 03, 2011 4:09 pm

hi,
Do you have Xcontrol installed? load the Sound control and adjust? It I guess is possible that a low output volume is set and stored in NVRam?

If all else fails load Iphegeny and try a reset? or just press all the buttons and shout! :lol:

/nativ
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Wed Aug 03, 2011 5:45 pm

well changed U21 amplifier IC today and still no change...

User avatar
wongck
Ultimate Atarian
Ultimate Atarian
Posts: 12462
Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 2:09 pm
Location: Far East
Contact:

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby wongck » Wed Aug 03, 2011 11:59 pm

Not sure if you tried this.
Use Fsound.CPX to change the GAIN & VOLUME.
My Stuff: FB/Falcon CT63/CTPCI+ATI+RTL8139+USB 512MB 30GB HDD CF HxC_SD/ TT030 68882 4+32MB 520MB Nova/ 520STFM 4MB Tos206 SCSI
Shared SCSI Bus:ScsiLink ethernet, 9GB HDD,SD-reader @ http://phsw.atari.org
My Atari stuff for sale - click here for list

User avatar
wongck
Ultimate Atarian
Ultimate Atarian
Posts: 12462
Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 2:09 pm
Location: Far East
Contact:

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby wongck » Thu Aug 04, 2011 12:06 am

Also there is a AUTO program call Falvol.prg (typing off my head.... ) that will half the current volume.
Make sure this one is not there.
My Stuff: FB/Falcon CT63/CTPCI+ATI+RTL8139+USB 512MB 30GB HDD CF HxC_SD/ TT030 68882 4+32MB 520MB Nova/ 520STFM 4MB Tos206 SCSI
Shared SCSI Bus:ScsiLink ethernet, 9GB HDD,SD-reader @ http://phsw.atari.org
My Atari stuff for sale - click here for list

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Thu Aug 04, 2011 6:49 pm

where can i find these programs?

there is no HD on this falcon so no reason why anything other than standard settings would be set

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4089
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby nativ » Thu Aug 04, 2011 8:28 pm

hi,

It is a possibility that a mid or low volume has previously been set in Fsound and stored in NVRAM.

getting Xcontrol and Fsound.cpx loaded and check settings is best bet, as your audio is working albeit quietly!

(software in atari1989's archive)

cheers
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

User avatar
wongck
Ultimate Atarian
Ultimate Atarian
Posts: 12462
Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 2:09 pm
Location: Far East
Contact:

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby wongck » Fri Aug 05, 2011 12:10 am

Sorry didn't know there was no hdd on it.
My Stuff: FB/Falcon CT63/CTPCI+ATI+RTL8139+USB 512MB 30GB HDD CF HxC_SD/ TT030 68882 4+32MB 520MB Nova/ 520STFM 4MB Tos206 SCSI
Shared SCSI Bus:ScsiLink ethernet, 9GB HDD,SD-reader @ http://phsw.atari.org
My Atari stuff for sale - click here for list

User avatar
majere
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 201
Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Spain

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby majere » Fri Aug 05, 2011 7:59 am

nativ wrote:hi,

It is a possibility that a mid or low volume has previously been set in Fsound and stored in NVRAM.

getting Xcontrol and Fsound.cpx loaded and check settings is best bet, as your audio is working albeit quietly!

(software in atari1989's archive)

cheers


A link will help :angel:
ATARI 520ST FM - ATARI MEGA4 - ATARI MEGASTE 4 - 2Xatari TT 30 & Crazy Dots + magnum TT +Netusbee // Falcon + 14mb + SCSI Plextor//Falcon+14mb+CT60+CTPCI+Ethernat

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Fri Aug 05, 2011 8:39 am

ok so downloaded the falcon language disk and tried the sound options in control panel

yes i can increase the sound via the R/L gain but that's not the answer

as soon as i switch it off and restart it goes back to quiet again

this board has a prob because the sound is quiet and "dull" just turning up the volume increases the dullness along with the hiss/hum of high volume

are sound options stored in nvram? i can't find any sound settings in the nvram options

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4089
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby nativ » Fri Aug 05, 2011 11:29 am

Hi,

When you save volume from FSound.cpx it will/ should stay set? definitely with the fsound.cpx loaded and probably without!

Right, so you get hiss and dull on audio via your FDI? optical/coaxial? and through the headphone out?

Does the DSP look ok? will thr falcon run dsp software ok?
I had my dsp fixed when I sent it to TUS a few years back! I had trouble with the headphone jack! they spotted the dsp issue and fixed it!

Have you tried different audio leads 3.5 jack? is it all the was in? not inserting fully will cause a similar symptom.

cheers
all the best!

/nativ

on the mobile so links aren't really possible! ;)
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Fri Aug 05, 2011 12:06 pm

nativ wrote:Hi,

Right, so you get hiss and dull on audio via your FDI? optical/coaxial? and through the headphone out?

Does the DSP look ok? will thr falcon run dsp software ok?
I had my dsp fixed when I sent it to TUS a few years back! I had trouble with the headphone jack! they spotted the dsp issue and fixed it!

Have you tried different audio leads 3.5 jack? is it all the was in? not inserting fully will cause a similar symptom.

cheers
all the best!

/nativ



yeah crap sound from all outputs: headphone jack / TV port with TV / monitor socket using with CM 8833 / internal speaker

so i guess this is something "central"

but as i say above and only people with test cartridges will know this there are 2 types of sound test

1: the normal Yamaha sound chip (PSG) as found in all ST/STE/mega etc - this is quiet

and then on the falcon the DMA sound test which test 4 different frequencies - this is LOUD!!!!!! and normal

MRAtari
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 5:03 pm

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby MRAtari » Fri Aug 05, 2011 12:59 pm

the below mod wouldn't have anything to do with it would it?

as this board has it (it was used for music)




microphone input gain mod:


•Remove R56, R57, R90, R92, C21 and C81
•Change R66 and R87 from 100K to 47K. (+) See note below!
•Add a 470pF NPO +/- 5% in parallel with R67
•Add a 470pF NPO +/-5% in parallel with R88
•Add a 100pF NPO +/-5% in parallel with R66
•Add a 100pF NPO +/-5% in parallel with R87
•(+)To achive apx. -10db sensitivity, change R66 and R87 from 100K to 1.8K instead of 47K (this is similar to most hi-fi equipment)

Latz
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 222
Joined: Tue Mar 08, 2011 6:02 pm
Location: Germany
Contact:

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby Latz » Fri Aug 05, 2011 3:00 pm

Hi,
these mods ONLY take effect to mic/headphone jacks, NOT for internal speaker!
So mic input is now "line in" (IIRC gain 0db) and headphone output is now
"line out" level (hifi).
So you're right, problem must be "more central".
Latz
Falcon/CT60 90MHz, 14+128 MB RAM, CTPCI/Radeon 9250/RTL8139, Carte Eiffel+LCD, 80GB IDE HD, DVD-RW.
Falcon/CT63 95 MHz, 4+128 MB RAM, CTPCI/Radeon 9250/RTL8139, Carte Eiffel+LCD, 80GB IDE HD, CD-RW.

User avatar
majere
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 201
Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Spain

Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby majere » Mon Aug 29, 2011 2:03 pm

With a sound cpx, I have put the sound at max, it was configured at minimum level.
ATARI 520ST FM - ATARI MEGA4 - ATARI MEGASTE 4 - 2Xatari TT 30 & Crazy Dots + magnum TT +Netusbee // Falcon + 14mb + SCSI Plextor//Falcon+14mb+CT60+CTPCI+Ethernat

User avatar
nativ
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Fuji Shaped Bastard
Posts: 4089
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2007 10:26 am
Location: South West, UK

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby nativ » Mon Aug 29, 2011 4:14 pm

:)

So it works ok now?
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

User avatar
majere
Captain Atari
Captain Atari
Posts: 201
Joined: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:58 pm
Location: Spain

Re: Falcon with quiet sound output

Postby majere » Mon Aug 29, 2011 5:02 pm

nativ wrote::)

So it works ok now?


Yes, and the rear jack too :D
ATARI 520ST FM - ATARI MEGA4 - ATARI MEGASTE 4 - 2Xatari TT 30 & Crazy Dots + magnum TT +Netusbee // Falcon + 14mb + SCSI Plextor//Falcon+14mb+CT60+CTPCI+Ethernat


Social Media

     

Return to “Professionals”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests