Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

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blastermaster84
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Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby blastermaster84 » Sat Apr 21, 2012 7:13 pm

Hello World! I have a big problem with Atari ST Software and I hope someone here can help me.

I bought a Commodore 64 and a MSSIAH cartridge about a year ago and it is genius. I can take ANY midi sequencer, keyboard, DAW, iphone, or whatever I want that has a MIDI out, plug it into the MSSIAH cartridge and it works perfectly. I can assign up to 3 midi channels, so i have 3 instruments simultaneous.

So how it can be, that this is possible on a C64 but not on a Atari ST with built in MIDI Interface?

So let me tell you I have already found a software called Chip Synth, but its very old and it can't use all the channels of the ST at once (correct me if I'm wrong).

Also a lot of people writing about maxYMiser, but for me it looks like all midi-functionality that this thing has is writing a note when i press one on the keyboard, but thats absolutely not what i search.

I know it might be a bit disrespectful but I'm not interested in programming my my music in prehistoric trackers. I work with a modern Cubase software and use C64 and MSSIAH as MIDI Sound Module. So again... is it really true that there is NOTHING COMPARABLE on Atari ST? I mean even Mega Drive, NES and GameBoy can do it why cant atari?!!

sorry if I'm a bit pissed off... but after searching for about 12 hours and finding nothing but crap I'm a bit disappointed and begin to think I'd better bought a second C64.

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Xerus
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby Xerus » Sun Apr 22, 2012 3:13 am

blastermaster84 wrote:So let me tell you I have already found a software called Chip Synth, but its very old and it can't use all the channels of the ST at once (correct me if I'm wrong).

This software Sound Chip Synth ?

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nativ
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby nativ » Sun Apr 22, 2012 8:41 am

http://www.google.co.uk/search?client=s ... 0QXFvJjbAQ


maxYMiser - Atari ST YM2149 chip tracker
maxYMiser is the best and most up to date chip tracker for Atari ST, and is still under ... maxYMiser is free, features a full MIDI implementation, and easy to use ...
www.preromanbritain.com/maxymiser/ - Cached - Similar

Electric Cow MIDI Arpeggiator & Sound Chip Synth
In March's Atari Notes, we looked at two pieces of software from Electronic Cow -- MIDI Arpeggiator and Sound Chip Synth -- both of which have now been ...
www.soundonsound.com/sos/1997_articles/ ... jun97.html - Cached - Similar
Atari STFM 512 / STe 4MB / Mega ST+DSP / Falcon 4MB 16Mhz 68882 - DVD/CDRW/ZIP/DAT - FDI / Jaguar / Lynx 1&2 / 7800 / 2600 / XE 130+SD Card // Sega Dreamcast / Mega2+CD2 // Apple G4

http://soundcloud.com/nativ ~ http://soundcloud.com/nativ-1 ~ http://soundcloud.com/knot_music
http://soundcloud.com/push-sounds ~ http://soundcloud.com/push-records

Kriegor
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby Kriegor » Fri Apr 27, 2012 12:28 am

http://www.preromanbritain.com/maxymiser/man_v129.txt

(10) MIDI Controllers
=====================
For maxYMiser to respond to MIDI controllers, they first need to be enabled in
the 'config' menu. MIDI controllers supported by maxYMiser are split in to
three types - Tracker controllers and Instrument controllers. Instrument
controllers are sensitive to MIDI channel, and operate only on the instrument
editor of a specific sound. Tracker controllers operate globally on maxYMiser
itself, or a YM/DMA channel, they respond on all MIDI channels.

(10.1) Tracker controllers
--------------------------
16,17,18,19,20 channel mutes
21 song speed
22 song position
23 jam mode
24 pattern/song play
25 pattern position
26 instrument select (disabled)
27 mouse pointer type
28 global noise transpose
29,30,31 YM channel noise transpose
32 global transpose
33,34,35,36,37 track transpose
38 global volume
39,40,41,42,43 track volume
44,45,46,47 next patterns (Jam mode)

(10.2) Instrument controllers
-----------------------------
60 volume sequence
61 arpeggio sequence
62 vibrato sequence
63 mixer sequence
64 noise sequence
65 fixed freq sequence
66 timer sequence
109 instrument volume
110 sequence speed
111 digi sample
112 digi rate
113 buzzer waveform
114 start sync
115 coarse tune
116 fine tune


Put another 12 hours into reading that manual and play around with the program, and you should be up and running without any piss or crap :)

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yerzmyey
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby yerzmyey » Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:42 pm

Forgive me Blastermaster84, but I don't entirely get Your trouble.

If You need a standard MIDI sequencer for other instruments - there is actually nothing better than Atari ST (even though its usage might be annoying for a person born after 1980 supposedly).

If You were looking for a new chiptune instrument/generaltor then also You have found a great tool/instrument in Atari ST.

If You're lookin' for both in one machine........ Well, I admit I have no idea. Instructions of some programs say it's possible.
But maybe other people would be more resonable here. ;)
http://ym-digital.i-demo.pl/ ATARI 520ST music-band
http://ay-riders.speccy.cz/ ZX Spectrum music-band
http://yerzmyey.i-demo.pl/ ZX/A500/A1200/ST/XL music
https://soundcloud.com/yerzmyey ZX/A500/A1200/ST/STE/F030 music
http://z80.i-demo.pl/ MP3 archive of Z80 chip music
No good deed will escape unpunished.

crx091081gb
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby crx091081gb » Sat Apr 28, 2012 3:13 pm

I was born in 81 and it serves me just fine. :lol:
Atari stuff: 1mb STFM with faulty disk drive (retired pending funding for repairs), 4mb STE TOS 2.06 + Ultrasatan + PeST + original monochrome monitor, Midi Stuff: Cubase 3.1, 2.0 (both dongled) + Midex+ + Manual + Handbook, Notator 3.21 (dongled) + Log3 + Unitor2 + Manual, M, lots of stuff downloaded of Tim's Atari Midi World

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yerzmyey
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby yerzmyey » Sat Apr 28, 2012 4:54 pm

:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
It's only a figure of speech. ;)
http://ym-digital.i-demo.pl/ ATARI 520ST music-band
http://ay-riders.speccy.cz/ ZX Spectrum music-band
http://yerzmyey.i-demo.pl/ ZX/A500/A1200/ST/XL music
https://soundcloud.com/yerzmyey ZX/A500/A1200/ST/STE/F030 music
http://z80.i-demo.pl/ MP3 archive of Z80 chip music
No good deed will escape unpunished.

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Atari74user
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby Atari74user » Sun Apr 29, 2012 10:20 am

Just to add, I'm not sure if people are missing blastermaster84's point here! It's in the title with all due respect 'Atari ST as a MIDI instrument', not running a sequencer as the Master in a MIDI set up, but as an instrument using the Atari ST's YM2149. Personally I have no need for this, as I use my ST...like many as the Master in a MIDI set up, controlling other instruments, typically using Cubase. I imagine blastermaster84 is using his old computers to make Chiptune music (not from a Tracker). I can't really comment, other than maybe Kreigor's response is the most appropriate, however having never used MaxYMiser who knows? It doesn't appear blastermaster84 wants to go this route!

For the record, it seems blastermaster84 is looking to do this (of sorts):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIuHSp3N ... re=related

You could always hack your ST to bits and go this route, quite impressive dedication shown here: 8O

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2x6LjxvlN34

Maybe I should consider a C64 and MSSIAH cart to add to the studio. The 8-bit scene largely seems to be the trend for Chiptune (what about the Amiga blastermaster84, you seem disappointed with the ST, how about this?) :wink: Having said this, I see no reason why using Electronic Cow's Sound Chip Synth or MaxiMYser would not not give you the same kind of results once hooked up to another computer or hardware sequencer to record the MIDI or even audio events. Seems to me the ST doesn't require this, other than putting a bit of thought into what you want!? Simplistically, all that is being done here is turning your computer into a sound module/synth. Hmmm, my ST and Falcon together using one as a bastardised Synth, why have I never thought about doing this using ultimately MaxYMiser? I think I have talked myself into something here, MaxYMiser, as it does just that, turn your Atari into a synth!
Atari Falcon 14mb, 68882, Dual 8gb CF, Steinberg FDI & Analog 8
Atari Jaguar, Rotary controller, Skunkboard & Cat Box
Atari 520STFM 4mb, TOS 2.06 switcher, OverScan, GigaFile, PARCP-USB, Unicorn-USB, System Solutions MiniS HD, SyQuest drives, ICD Link II, PhatBoy MIDI Controller, Philip Rees 5M MIDI merge box, SoundPool MO4, Steinberg MIDEX, SMP II, Emagic Log 3, C-Lab Unitor 2, Combiner & Export expanders

Kriegor
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby Kriegor » Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:25 pm

Atari74user wrote:Just to add, a lot of people are missing blastermaster84's point here! It's in the title with all due respect 'Atari ST as a MIDI instrument', not running a sequencer as the Master in a MIDI set up, but as an instrument using the Atari ST's YM2149. Personally I have no need for this, as I use my ST...like many as the Master in a MIDI set up, controlling other instruments, typically using Cubase. I imagine blastermaster84 is using his old computers to make Chiptune music (not from a Tracker). I can't really comment, other than maybe Kreigor's response is the most appropriate, however having never used MaxYMiser who knows? It doesn't appear blastermaster84 wants to go this route!

For the record, for those that are confused, blastermaster84 is looking to do this (of sorts):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WIuHSp3N ... re=related

You could always hack your ST to bits and go this route, quite impressive dedication shown here: 8O

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2x6LjxvlN34

Maybe I should consider a C64 and MSSIAH cart to add to the studio, as I don't believe anybody has made anything in the same vein for the Atari ST for it to be used exactly in this way, maybe as the 8-bit scene largely seems to be the trend for Chiptune (asuming the Amiga is also not supported given you have not mentioned anything about this Commodore) :wink: Although I have not done this, I see no reason why using Electronic Cow's Sound Chip Synth or MaxiMYser would not not give you the same kind of results once hooked up to another computer or hardware sequencer to record the MIDI or even audio events. Seems to me the ST doesn't require this, other than putting a bit of thought into what you want!? Simplistically, all that is being done here is turning your computer into a sound module/synth. Hmmm, my ST and Falcon together using one as a bastardised Synth, why have I never thought about doing this using ultimately MaxYMiser? I think I have talked myself into something here, MaxYMiser, as it does just that, turn your Atari into a synth!


Yeah i guess the issue here is really a non-issue. The ST has got a built in MIDI interface. Other systems like the C64 or NES which doesn't have built in MIDI interfaces has to be used with some sort of hardware MIDI interface if you want to control the sound chips. Those interfaces (at least most of the popular later ones like MSSIAH) also contains some kind of on-board software to make it easy and straight-forward (or even possible) to use the system as a kind of MIDI controlled synth. This means two things - 1: it's easy to use 2: it limits you to the software on the cartridge (generally speaking). With the ST there's no need for the interface so you just have to get yourself some software to control the YM2149, in your case with MIDI support for using another computer as a sequencer. The most popular one today i guess is maxYMiser, but it might be a bit hard to learn if you're not used to tracking, hex-values and such stuff. MusicMon is also popular: http://pouet.net/prod.php?which=18929 and i believe it's easier to use. Both of them are trackers but could just as well be used as just "synths". Then you got the "chip synth" which as you've already discovered, is monophonic and uses up to all three hardware channels for one monophonic powerful "synth". As you're using an external DAW you could just record the output of that synth in several takes though? Or you could get all three hardware channels with maxYMiser/MusicMon if you want that, or something else. The choice is up to the user - which might be the reason to why you're a bit confused ;) I'd suggest to get started with MusicMon, hook it up to your sequencer, read through the manual and try it out to understand how everything works and sounds. You'll might even get a sudden urge to use the actual tracker for sequencing rather than some modern computer DAW! :)


And yeah, that second video 8O Great work :)

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Atari74user
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Re: Please Help! Atari ST as MIDI Instrument

Postby Atari74user » Sun Apr 29, 2012 3:37 pm

I agree, as I started typing the above reply I was wondering why I was actually typing, it's a non issue, the ST has a built in MIDI interface and it's up to you how you want to use it, as the master in a MIDI set up controlling other instruments, or as a synth connected to another computer (Atari of course) utilising something that turns it into a YM2149 synth, namely some kind of Tracker or Soft 'Soundchip' Synth, those being all what have been mentioned in this string before. MaxYMiser being little more than just a Tracker in fairness. It's really as simple as knowing what you want! I remember way back when getting into Trackers when I was a teenager, since then I progressed to using my Atari(s) in a MIDI set up. I never have really thought about turning one of my machines into a synth using the YM chip, via a connected synth / controller keyboard. Will give one of my machines extra life 8)
Atari Falcon 14mb, 68882, Dual 8gb CF, Steinberg FDI & Analog 8
Atari Jaguar, Rotary controller, Skunkboard & Cat Box
Atari 520STFM 4mb, TOS 2.06 switcher, OverScan, GigaFile, PARCP-USB, Unicorn-USB, System Solutions MiniS HD, SyQuest drives, ICD Link II, PhatBoy MIDI Controller, Philip Rees 5M MIDI merge box, SoundPool MO4, Steinberg MIDEX, SMP II, Emagic Log 3, C-Lab Unitor 2, Combiner & Export expanders


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