Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

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Neild323
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Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby Neild323 » Sun Aug 27, 2017 1:59 pm

Hello again peeps!
My dream is to own a YM/Chiptune device which could act as a module for use in a DAW (I'm using ableton). This is because I want to create my own synths & be able to edit parameters within my DAW (sequence changes in the sound like, switching arpeggio lengths during the timeline, vary vibrato amounts, what ever modulation relevant which I could draw in or record using perhaps assigned knobs on my midi keyboard as a bonus). Is there anything homebrew or commercially available yet?

A great chap on here introduced me to twisted electron's AY-3, but I don't think it supports a DAW, it seems like its only able to be sequenced on the device itself, although I sent the manufacturer a quick email to ask if it'd be possible to sequence parameters of each synth within a DAW through midi, but haven't heard back (from what I understand it doesn't seem possible with the AY3).

So the last option is to get an AY-3 MK2, but I won't be able to sequence it within ableton & would have to record any complicated/skilled trickery in real time in order to get the sound down. I've been brought up on cubase & sound modules like Roland Super JV & Fantom XR, I thought that by now there would be something similar, chip specific which could allow me to tweak a whole set of parameters & perhaps even set 16 sound banks of different synths & YM drums?

I tried Gwem's VST emulator but it'll only work on windows. I also thought of buying a MiST so I could record the output in the same BPM & transport that into ableton, but I'd still be keen to know if theres anything I can get which is compatible with midi in this way, & flexible enough to bend & twist the YM sound to your hearts desire? Or perhaps I'm just too much of a dreamer!

Often when I think of things like this, someone invents it around the time I wanting one. Hoping that's happened already or they're still on it...

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farvardin
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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby farvardin » Sun Aug 27, 2017 5:02 pm

Have you had a look to this?
https://github.com/trash80/Ym2149Synth

I don't know if you can control it from a DAW though.

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby dma » Sun Aug 27, 2017 5:14 pm

Actually the most simple way to achieve this, is probably to use a real ST with software to control its YM2149 chip from MIDI input.

Possible software candidate would be maxYMiser (pretty sure some MIDI IN configuration can achieve this),
or Electric Cow Sound Chip Synth (but website seems down).

Also check those threads covering the same subject:
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=7095
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=15972
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=23256

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby YQN » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:03 am

dma wrote:Actually the most simple way to achieve this, is probably to use a real ST with software to control its YM2149 chip from MIDI input.

Possible software candidate would be maxYMiser (pretty sure some MIDI IN configuration can achieve this),

I was going to suggest that. You'll have to spend some time on sound design on the ST first (or use the provided instruments). Check gwEm's tutorials (on that preroman ink above and on youtube) to have a better grasp on what you can and cannot do with MIDI and maxYMiser. I made this track a few years ago using Reaper, Reason and an ST, I don't remember having problem setting that up.

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby YQN » Tue Sep 05, 2017 10:05 am

You can as well use an emulator with MIDI support

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby Atari74user » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:17 pm

Hey there, what makes you think the AY-3 cannot be sequenced? I don't see any reason why it cannot. As per the very brief specs, it can be controlled via MIDI CC messages, so I don't see any reason why it cannot be sequenced using an external sequencer or DAW. I agree, how in depth it can be controlled is not forthcoming in it's specs, but in terms of it being sequenced, it has MIDI, it accepts being controlled via CC messages, so it should be able to be sequenced.

The manual also shows some of the MIDI control: http://cdns3.gear4music.com/media/22/228605/download_228605.pdf

Also, I bought one of these about 2 months ago, I am still in flux after a house move, so my little studio is still in boxes, however it looks a cool little YM sound module, more limiting than the AY-3, but pure YM:

https://catskullelectronics.com/YM2149

This is the one that Farvardin mentions in this thread, which the guy at Catskull used to build his version:

Have you had a look to this?
https://github.com/trash80/Ym2149Synth
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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby Atari74user » Tue Sep 05, 2017 8:51 pm

There is also the Papilio RetroCade which incorporates both C64 SID and YM2149 chip recreation: http://retrocade.gadgetfactory.net/
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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby Neild323 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:29 pm

farvardin wrote:Have you had a look to this?
https://github.com/trash80/Ym2149Synth

I don't know if you can control it from a DAW though.


Hey there. I've been looking at this one and yes, it can be controlled with a DAW, it receives CC commands which can be applied to different parameters in a DAW. I've opened a chat with the manufacturer the other day so waiting to hear more about it, as I think it could do just what I'm wanting. Sure many more would like one too if it does what I hope it does! I'm waiting to see just how much can be controlled in a DAW with the source code loaded onto it & if I could add additional code to create further synths etc.

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby Neild323 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 12:34 pm

dma wrote:Actually the most simple way to achieve this, is probably to use a real ST with software to control its YM2149 chip from MIDI input.

Possible software candidate would be maxYMiser (pretty sure some MIDI IN configuration can achieve this),
or Electric Cow Sound Chip Synth (but website seems down).

Also check those threads covering the same subject:
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=7095
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=15972
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=23256


Cheers for this, & apologies that I only saw these replies to the thread just now. I mustn't have known where to look for notifications on the forum a till recently & can now see all these responses!
That exact method, using maxYMiser is my next test, I'll also give it a go with electronic cow's musicmon too which is a great piece of software. i have a USB to midi interface so I think it'll be safe to send data to the Atari using that, sequenced in ableton. Might try it today if I've chance, just need to burn it to floppy & give it a go :-)

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby Neild323 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:46 pm

I'm all set to go, the only thing I'm unsure about it how to put MaxYMiser or musicmon onto floppy. I use makedisk and can put ST or MSA files to floppy, but MaxYMiser & Musicmon are PRG files with additional folders. I'm unsure if I need to make them into an MSA file to put onto floppy or if I need a different tool than makedisk to achieve it. I couldn't find any information online, specifically about this issue, but I have everything ready to put to the test! In the long run it will be the best way to do it, till I can afford a MIST.

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby farvardin » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:46 pm

I wouldn't advice to use floppies, they are not really reliable. Gotek + hxc firmware are great.
Anyway, if you own a floppy drive on your pc, or if you have an usb floppy drive, just format a floppy on your atari, insert the floppy in your pc, and copy the files from musicmon or maxymiser directly on the floppy. You can use an atari emulator such as hatari to extract from and to .ST image files if needed

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Re: Do YM Sound Modules Exist?

Postby Neild323 » Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:55 pm

farvardin wrote:I wouldn't advice to use floppies, they are not really reliable. Gotek + hxc firmware are great.
Anyway, if you own a floppy drive on your pc, or if you have an usb floppy drive, just format a floppy on your atari, insert the floppy in your pc, and copy the files from musicmon or maxymiser directly on the floppy. You can use an atari emulator such as hatari to extract from and to .ST image files if needed


Thanks for the heads up. Eventually I'd like to set up my Atari hardware for this purpose, but to just get going & test it for now I"m going to try it with floppys. When I get stuck into producing with it I'll be using a hard drive & looking into ways to keep things stable, I remember as a kid just how unreliable floppy disks are!
I have a dell PC with a built in floppy drive which I use for burning Atari disks. I tried something similar last night, I formatted it with my Atari ST and tried dragging the files to it in windows but, windows wouldn't accept the Atari ST format to give me access. My I will try some different formatting settings.
Thats great to know I could extract the files on an emulator, cheers for that. If I have no luck in windows I'll extract musicmon to ST file & use makedisk to burn the floppy. Just trying to get round my PC not starting up though! haha, computers, one thing to the next sometimes, keeping me busy tho!


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